From rjh at sixdemonbag.org  Fri May  1 00:03:55 2009
From: rjh at sixdemonbag.org (Robert J. Hansen)
Date: Fri, 01 May 2009 03:03:55 -0400
Subject: [Enigmail] Encrypt newsposts
In-Reply-To: <49FA9518.9090102@hajo-kirchhoff.de>
References: <49F9ACC4.30500@hajo-kirchhoff.de> <49F9F440.6070904@bellsouth.net>
	<49FA9518.9090102@hajo-kirchhoff.de>
Message-ID: <49FA9EDB.9000805@sixdemonbag.org>

mailinglists wrote:
> my problem is that enigmail refuses to encrypt posts. Actively refuses.

This is not an Enigmail defect, the same way that it's not a defect for
a pistol to refuse to fire if the safety is on.  In both cases, the
tools are behaving entirely properly, and have been designed that way
for your safety.

As a few people here have already told you, it doesn't make sense to use
asymmetric crypto to post encrypted messages to a newsgroup.  Enigmail
is not refusing to encrypt posts; it's refusing to let you do something
that it's pretty sure is a mistake.

What you want to do is _incredibly_ niche -- in a dozen years of being
active in the PGP world, this is the first time I've ever heard of it --
and it's reasonable for Enigmail to not support incredibly niche uses.
If we support this behavior, we will probably field hundreds of
"Enigmail doesn't work, it's garbling all my newsgroup posts!" for every
user who has a legitimate use case for the feature.

I would suggest going a different route.  Tell us what your specific
need is.  What do you wish to achieve?  There are probably better ways
to do it than this.



From John at Mozilla-Enigmail.org  Fri May  1 00:04:42 2009
From: John at Mozilla-Enigmail.org (John Clizbe)
Date: Fri, 01 May 2009 02:04:42 -0500
Subject: [Enigmail] Encrypt newsposts
In-Reply-To: <49FA9518.9090102@hajo-kirchhoff.de>
References: <49F9ACC4.30500@hajo-kirchhoff.de> <49F9F440.6070904@bellsouth.net>
	<49FA9518.9090102@hajo-kirchhoff.de>
Message-ID: <49FA9F0A.5030804@Mozilla-Enigmail.org>

mailinglists wrote:
> Hi, thank you all,
> 
> my problem is that enigmail refuses to encrypt posts. Actively refuses.
> 
> I am using a shared public/private key and have set up identity and
> rules such that encrypting is active when posting to this particular
> newsgroup, say it's called rc.test
> 
> Enigmail finds the rule but then refuses to continue.
> 
> So it's not a matter of how to set up my keys, I (think I) already done
> that. It's just that enigmail detects a newsgroup address in the
> recipients and then prints this error and stops with this error message.
> 
>>> Presently enigmail complains: "Encrypted send operation aborted.\n\nThis
>>> message cannot be encrypted because there are newsgroup recipients."
> 

<inline discussion snipped>
> 
> Thank you, I already did that. But enigmail refuses to inline encrypt my
> post.

I'm going to go out on a limb and say Enigmail is "Doing The Right
Thing(tm)". This is probably the only time I've ever seen mention of
encrypting news, so I don't think Enigmail should be changed to allow
it. It's an outlier behavior.

I think you're going to need to do your encryption up-front before
clicking Send. PGPDesktop/GPGshell/WinPT all provide both current-window
and clipboard capability for doing this.

My $0.02.
-- 
John P. Clizbe                      Inet:John (a) Mozilla-Enigmail.org
You can't spell fiasco without SCO. hkp://keyserver.gingerbear.net  or
     mailto:pgp-public-keys at gingerbear.net?subject=HELP

Q:"Just how do the residents of Haiku, Hawai'i hold conversations?"
A:"An odd melody / island voices on the winds / surplus of vowels"

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From mailinglists at hajo-kirchhoff.de  Fri May  1 00:54:58 2009
From: mailinglists at hajo-kirchhoff.de (mailinglists)
Date: Fri, 01 May 2009 09:54:58 +0200
Subject: [Enigmail] Encrypt newsposts
In-Reply-To: <49FA9EDB.9000805@sixdemonbag.org>
References: <49F9ACC4.30500@hajo-kirchhoff.de>
	<49F9F440.6070904@bellsouth.net>	<49FA9518.9090102@hajo-kirchhoff.de>
	<49FA9EDB.9000805@sixdemonbag.org>
Message-ID: <49FAAAD2.4020305@hajo-kirchhoff.de>

Hi Robert,
>> my problem is that enigmail refuses to encrypt posts. Actively refuses.
>>     
> This is not an Enigmail defect, the same way that it's not a defect for
> a pistol to refuse to fire if the safety is on.  
I didn't think it was a defect, I thought enigmail was being overly
protective. My question is, how do I disable safety? I know what I am
doing and don't (always) want a tool protecting me from myself.
> As a few people here have already told you, it doesn't make sense to use
> asymmetric crypto to post encrypted messages to a newsgroup.
>   
Well, every once in a while, someone with more than 20 years experience
in the computer/programming field comes along and is pretty sure he
knows what he is doing ;-) And I think in my case it makes sense, but
perhaps you've got a better idea. See below.
> What you want to do is _incredibly_ niche -- in a dozen years of being
> active in the PGP world, this is the first time I've ever heard of it --
> and it's reasonable for Enigmail to not support incredibly niche uses.
>   
Oh perhaps its niche, but is it unreasonably for me to ask if there is
some switch to disable safety? It's not as if it isn't supported.
Instead my impression is that it is actively prohibited, IOW some safety
code was added, not some feature left out.
> I would suggest going a different route.  Tell us what your specific
> need is.  What do you wish to achieve?  There are probably better ways
> to do it than this.
>   
I would love to hear any ideas. Here is what I need. There is this small
software project with a handful of developers, testers and managers.
Currently we do all discussion via email, which is pretty cumbersome and
has its own problems. My idea was to set up a private news server with
access restrictions and SSL encrypting traffic to and from. But this
still leaves posts unencrypted on the server and on the clients as well,
which is unacceptable to the management. So my suggestion was to create
a shared group key and use thunderbird+enigmail to post to the news
server, just like we used email before. To my great surprise enigmail
refused to encrypt the posts.

I used that idea a couple of years back with success using MS-Outlook
Express and "hamster" as a news server, but Outlook is out of the
question here :)

Any ideas? Here are the requirements:
+ Find a better alternative for software and project discussions than
email. News would suit fine.
+ Support access control.
+ Don't leave news posts unencrypted on the server or anywhere else.
They should be decrypted on the fly, just like enigmail does.
+ Allow easy archiving of old posts.
+ Allow new members to read old posts, which rules out encryping mails
to a predefined set of keys, as the keys of potentially new members are
not known to the original poster.

Now it's not that we are developing some super secret weapon. It's just
that management, for once, is actually aware of and interested in using
encryption. I am pretty glad that there are managers that care about
things like that and I want to support that. Also, as they have
outsourced their entire IT-Administration (including backups but
excluding PGP keys of course), I can understand they do not want their
contractor to be able to snoop in our discussion.

Many thanks and regards

Hajo


From mailinglists at hajo-kirchhoff.de  Fri May  1 01:02:12 2009
From: mailinglists at hajo-kirchhoff.de (mailinglists)
Date: Fri, 01 May 2009 10:02:12 +0200
Subject: [Enigmail] Encrypt newsposts
In-Reply-To: <49FA9F0A.5030804@Mozilla-Enigmail.org>
References: <49F9ACC4.30500@hajo-kirchhoff.de>
	<49F9F440.6070904@bellsouth.net>	<49FA9518.9090102@hajo-kirchhoff.de>
	<49FA9F0A.5030804@Mozilla-Enigmail.org>
Message-ID: <49FAAC84.6080302@hajo-kirchhoff.de>

Hi John,
> I think you're going to need to do your encryption up-front before
> clicking Send. PGPDesktop/GPGshell/WinPT all provide both current-window
> and clipboard capability for doing this.
>   
thanks for the suggestion, but that is out of the question. It's too
easy to forget to hit Ctrl+Alt+Whatever to encrypt the post before
hitting send. It needs to be fully automated, such as with the enigmail
rules.

Regards

Hajo

From rjh at sixdemonbag.org  Fri May  1 01:32:37 2009
From: rjh at sixdemonbag.org (Robert J. Hansen)
Date: Fri, 01 May 2009 04:32:37 -0400
Subject: [Enigmail] Encrypt newsposts
In-Reply-To: <49FAAAD2.4020305@hajo-kirchhoff.de>
References: <49F9ACC4.30500@hajo-kirchhoff.de>	<49F9F440.6070904@bellsouth.net>	<49FA9518.9090102@hajo-kirchhoff.de>	<49FA9EDB.9000805@sixdemonbag.org>
	<49FAAAD2.4020305@hajo-kirchhoff.de>
Message-ID: <49FAB3A5.9020203@sixdemonbag.org>

mailinglists wrote:
> I didn't think it was a defect, I thought enigmail was being overly 
> protective.  My question is, how do I disable [the] safety?

When people start talking about disabling weapon safeties because the
safety is overly protective, some sense of primordial self-preservation
deep in my hindbrain demands that I dive for cover.

You may want to think a bit about what you've just said here.

> I know what I am doing

I hope you won't take offense, but I doubt this to be true.

> Well, every once in a while, someone with more than 20 years 
> experience in the computer/programming field comes along and is 
> pretty sure he knows what he is doing ;-)

28 years of experience here, plus a thesis away from a Ph.D. in secure
software engineering.  Up until a few months ago I was breaking
electronic voting machines for a living.

John Clizbe has 34 years of experience.

Be very careful when you start using your years of experience as an
argument that you know what you're doing.  You quickly run afoul of
Whitaker's Law that way.  "Do not fall into the trap of the artisan who
boasts of twenty years' experience in his craft while in fact he has
only one year of experience -- twenty times."

> Oh perhaps its niche, but is it unreasonably for me to ask if there 
> is some switch to disable safety? It's not as if it isn't supported.

It is exactly the case that it isn't supported, and this lack of support
is a conscious design decision.

> There is this small software project with a handful of developers,
> testers and managers. Currently we do all discussion via email, which
> is pretty cumbersome and has its own problems. My idea was to set up
> a private news server with access restrictions and SSL encrypting
> traffic to and from. But this still leaves posts unencrypted on the
> server and on the clients as well, which is unacceptable to the
> management.

GNU Mailman to the rescue.  You don't want a news server for this.  Once
you have a private mailing list set up for the group, create a
per-recipient rule for the mailing list which will encrypt the traffic
to the keys of each member of the group.  Since the group is going to be
relatively small and by invitation only, the key management problem is
quite tractable.

Two years ago there was a nationwide mailing list for voting security
researchers.  That's exactly how they did it.  Dan Wallach of Rice
University said that Enigmail worked like a champ in that situation,
much better than PGP Desktop, Evolution, KMail, or other OpenPGP-aware
clients.

If you don't want to host your own mailing lists, you could even do
something through Yahoo! Groups.  The PGPNET mailing list does exactly
this.  John Moore is one of the list moderators; he's active on this
list and will be happy to walk you through the process of doing this.

Your goal is achieved, and the safety stays on.  Sounds like a win to me.

> Allow new members to read old posts, which rules out encryping mails
> to a predefined set of keys, as the keys of potentially new members
> are not known to the original poster.

So you have a Perl script that goes through all the messages, decrypts
them, encrypts them with the new subscriber's key, and sends them
off-list a copy of all traffic sent to this point.  It's not a hard problem.



From John at Mozilla-Enigmail.org  Fri May  1 01:34:47 2009
From: John at Mozilla-Enigmail.org (John Clizbe)
Date: Fri, 01 May 2009 03:34:47 -0500
Subject: [Enigmail] Encrypt newsposts
In-Reply-To: <49FAAC84.6080302@hajo-kirchhoff.de>
References: <49F9ACC4.30500@hajo-kirchhoff.de>	<49F9F440.6070904@bellsouth.net>	<49FA9518.9090102@hajo-kirchhoff.de>	<49FA9F0A.5030804@Mozilla-Enigmail.org>
	<49FAAC84.6080302@hajo-kirchhoff.de>
Message-ID: <49FAB427.1040905@Mozilla-Enigmail.org>

mailinglists wrote:
> Hi John,
>> I think you're going to need to do your encryption up-front before
>> clicking Send. PGPDesktop/GPGshell/WinPT all provide both current-window
>> and clipboard capability for doing this.
>>   
> thanks for the suggestion, but that is out of the question. It's too
> easy to forget to hit Ctrl+Alt+Whatever to encrypt the post before
> hitting send. It needs to be fully automated, such as with the enigmail
> rules.

Is 34 years coding and doing system design&admin with 30 of that getting
paid for it OK with your other reply to Rob (the more than 20 years
part)? ;-)

I have absolutely NO issue with what you are trying to achieve, but news
just doesn't feel like the proper solution implementation.

From your other reply:
> Any ideas? Here are the requirements:
> + Find a better alternative for software and project discussions than
> email. News would suit fine.
> + Support access control.
> + Don't leave news posts unencrypted on the server or anywhere else.
> They should be decrypted on the fly, just like enigmail does.
> + Allow easy archiving of old posts.
> + Allow new members to read old posts, which rules out encryping mails
>   to a predefined set of keys, as the keys of potentially new members
>   are not known to the original poster.

What part of the current email setup is so cumbersome/wearisome? I ask
because email really is, IMO, the best solution.

How about a email list, subscriptions are moderated to prevent
unauthorized list access. Say mailman?

delivery can be imap or POP3, but I'd use POP with a local mbox for each
client machine.

The list manager is easily configured  to archive all posts to a mbox
formatted file which may be downloaded to give new members access to all
prior posts.

That to me looks to meet all your requirements. Single delivery address
with automatic encryption to a shared key.

> Now it's not that we are developing some super secret weapon. It's
> just that management, for once, is actually aware of and interested
> in using encryption. I am pretty glad that there are managers that
> care about things like that and I want to support that. Also, as they
> have outsourced their entire IT-Administration (including backups but
>  excluding PGP keys of course), I can understand they do not want
> their contractor to be able to snoop in our discussion.

Kudos to your management for going along with encryption.

-- 
John P. Clizbe                      Inet:John (a) Mozilla-Enigmail.org
You can't spell fiasco without SCO. hkp://keyserver.gingerbear.net  or
     mailto:pgp-public-keys at gingerbear.net?subject=HELP

Q:"Just how do the residents of Haiku, Hawai'i hold conversations?"
A:"An odd melody / island voices on the winds / surplus of vowels"

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From andy.ruddock at rainydayz.org  Fri May  1 01:41:50 2009
From: andy.ruddock at rainydayz.org (Andy Ruddock)
Date: Fri, 01 May 2009 10:41:50 +0200
Subject: [Enigmail] Encrypt newsposts
In-Reply-To: <49FAAC84.6080302@hajo-kirchhoff.de>
References: <49F9ACC4.30500@hajo-kirchhoff.de>	<49F9F440.6070904@bellsouth.net>	<49FA9518.9090102@hajo-kirchhoff.de>	<49FA9F0A.5030804@Mozilla-Enigmail.org>
	<49FAAC84.6080302@hajo-kirchhoff.de>
Message-ID: <49FAB5CE.1050801@rainydayz.org>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

mailinglists wrote:
> Hi John,
>> I think you're going to need to do your encryption up-front before
>> clicking Send. PGPDesktop/GPGshell/WinPT all provide both current-window
>> and clipboard capability for doing this.
>>   
> thanks for the suggestion, but that is out of the question. It's too
> easy to forget to hit Ctrl+Alt+Whatever to encrypt the post before
> hitting send. It needs to be fully automated, such as with the enigmail
> rules.
> 

Per-recipient rules cover this.

- --
Andy Ruddock
- ------------
andy.ruddock at rainydayz.org (GPG Key ID 0xA622D452)
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Version: GnuPG v1.4.9 (GNU/Linux)
Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org

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From jmoore3rd at bellsouth.net  Fri May  1 05:09:49 2009
From: jmoore3rd at bellsouth.net (John W. Moore III)
Date: Fri, 01 May 2009 08:09:49 -0400
Subject: [Enigmail] Encrypt newsposts
In-Reply-To: <49FAB3A5.9020203@sixdemonbag.org>
References: <49F9ACC4.30500@hajo-kirchhoff.de>	<49F9F440.6070904@bellsouth.net>	<49FA9518.9090102@hajo-kirchhoff.de>	<49FA9EDB.9000805@sixdemonbag.org>	<49FAAAD2.4020305@hajo-kirchhoff.de>
	<49FAB3A5.9020203@sixdemonbag.org>
Message-ID: <49FAE68D.2070806@bellsouth.net>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA512

Robert J. Hansen wrote:

> If you don't want to host your own mailing lists, you could even do
> something through Yahoo! Groups.  The PGPNET mailing list does exactly
> this.  John Moore is one of the list moderators; he's active on this
> list and will be happy to walk you through the process of doing this.

My following of this thread so far indicates to Me that the 'Problem'
lies in the use of a News Group Server.  Because of the code within
Thunderbird/SeaMonkey making them News Group readers as well as MUA's
Enigmail will continue to block Your attempts to encrypt to what it
perceives as a Public Forum.

Use of a Group with Group Encryption using either a single Group Key or
encrypting to each individual Members Key is quite feasible.  Robert is
correct that I participate in this very activity several times a day.
Robert mentioned that PGPNET utilizes Yahoo Groups but the capability is
also workable using Google Groups.  Yahoo Groups offers a more
'attractive' interface but Google Groups offers some more esoteric
flexibility.  [IMAP, etc.,]

Should You choose to follow this route it will take roughly 20 minutes
of effort on the part of a Group Owner and about 5 minutes on the part
of each individual Member.

Please Note that Yahoo Groups has just 'Upgraded' Groups in the way in
which attachments are handled.  How they are handled is configured by
the specific Group.  Want them passed along?  Archived on the Group
site?  Your choice.

HTH

JOHN 8-)
Timestamp: Friday 01 May 2009, 08:09  --400 (Eastern Daylight Time)
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
Version: GnuPG v1.4.10-svn4987: (MingW32)
Comment: Public Key at:  http://tinyurl.com/8cpho
Comment: Gossamer Spider Web of Trust: https://www.gswot.org
Comment: Homepage:  http://tinyurl.com/yzhbhx

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=MKNr
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From tspivey at pcdesk.net  Sat May  2 07:18:58 2009
From: tspivey at pcdesk.net (Tyler Spivey)
Date: Sat, 2 May 2009 07:18:58 -0700
Subject: [Enigmail] Questions on per-recipient rules
Message-ID: <20090502141858.GA29558@arch1>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

1. Is it possible to import/export Per-recipient rules? Currently, creating them
is a quite tedius process and I don't want to  go through it again if I don't need to.

2. Would it be possible, in a future version of enigmail, to make the spacebar check/uncheck the keys in the per-recipient rule key selection dialog? That would make it
quite a bit easier to just scroll through and check keys.
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=Fgf+
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From mlisten at hammernoch.net  Sat May  2 08:08:44 2009
From: mlisten at hammernoch.net (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Ludwig_H=FCgelsch=E4fer?=)
Date: Sat, 02 May 2009 17:08:44 +0200
Subject: [Enigmail] Questions on per-recipient rules
In-Reply-To: <20090502141858.GA29558@arch1>
References: <20090502141858.GA29558@arch1>
Message-ID: <49FC61FC.7090804@hammernoch.net>

Hi,

Tyler Spivey wrote on 02.05.2009 16:18 Uhr:
> 1. Is it possible to import/export Per-recipient rules? Currently, creating them
> is a quite tedius process and I don't want to  go through it again if I don't need to.

The rules are not im/exportable by GUI, but with a little experience you
will find a file named "pgprules.xml" in your Thunderbird/Seamonkey
profile. Just back it up or to copy it another computer/mail profile.
The profile directory location depends on platform/OS.


> 2. Would it be possible, in a future version of enigmail, to make the spacebar
> check/uncheck the keys in the per-recipient rule key selection dialog? That would make it
> quite a bit easier to just scroll through and check keys.

Good idea!

Ludwig


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From hrickards at l33tmyst.com  Sun May  3 00:21:43 2009
From: hrickards at l33tmyst.com (Harry Rickards)
Date: Sun, 03 May 2009 08:21:43 +0100
Subject: [Enigmail] Color Coding
Message-ID: <49FD4607.7050600@l33tmyst.com>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

Sorry if it's been asked before, but what trust level does a public key
have to have before the blue EnigMail bar turns to green? As far as I
can tell it seems to be Ultimately, but surely if you trusted someone
Fully the bar should turn to green? Also, is there anyway to change this
setting.


- --
Many thanks
Harry Rickards (a.k.a l33tmyst)

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- ------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------
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Version: GnuPG v1.4.9 (GNU/Linux)
Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org

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=YWIH
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From post at lespocky.de  Sun May  3 02:09:53 2009
From: post at lespocky.de (Alexander Dahl)
Date: Sun, 03 May 2009 11:09:53 +0200
Subject: [Enigmail] Color Coding
In-Reply-To: <49FD4607.7050600@l33tmyst.com>
References: <49FD4607.7050600@l33tmyst.com>
Message-ID: <0ML31I-1M0XiI1YhU-0000Bi@mrelayeu.kundenserver.de>

Hi,

> Sorry if it's been asked before, but what trust level does a public key
> have to have before the blue EnigMail bar turns to green? As far as I
> can tell it seems to be Ultimately, but surely if you trusted someone
> Fully the bar should turn to green? Also, is there anyway to change this
> setting.

Trustlevel full is enough for green. You only set your very own key to
ultimately. It's not relevant if the computed or user set trustlevel is
full, if any of them (or both) the bar turns green.

Be sure to set the user trust level to full only for users you really
trust. There was a discussion about this on this mailing list just a few
days ago.

Greets
Alex

-- 
***** http://www.lespocky.de *******************************************
Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase
a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety.
                                (Benjamin Franklin)

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From shavital at mac.com  Sun May  3 02:16:11 2009
From: shavital at mac.com (Charly Avital)
Date: Sun, 03 May 2009 05:16:11 -0400
Subject: [Enigmail] Color Coding
In-Reply-To: <49FD4607.7050600@l33tmyst.com>
References: <49FD4607.7050600@l33tmyst.com>
Message-ID: <49FD60DB.5070300@mac.com>

Harry Rickards wrote the following on 5/3/09 3:21 AM:
> Sorry if it's been asked before, but what trust level does a public key
> have to have before the blue EnigMail bar turns to green? As far as I
> can tell it seems to be Ultimately, but surely if you trusted someone
> Fully the bar should turn to green? Also, is there anyway to change this
> setting.
> 

Upon verifying your in-line signed e-mail:
OpenPGP Security Info
UNTRUSTED Good signature from Harry Rickards (Email GPG Key)
<hrickards at l33tmyst.com>
Key ID: 0x646ED06A / Signed on: 5/3/09 3:21 AM
Key fingerprint: 7F78 596A 2DBB BE27 792A A44E D646 73DE 646E D06A


The bar is blue (bluish...). UNTRUSTED Good Signature.


Just for the exercise:
- local signed your key (non exportable signature)
- set trust level to 3 (marginal)

OpenPGP Security Info
Good signature from Harry Rickards (Email GPG Key) <hrickards at l33tmyst.com>
Key ID: 0x646ED06A / Signed on: 5/3/09 3:21 AM
Key fingerprint: 7F78 596A 2DBB BE27 792A A44E D646 73DE 646E D06A

The bar is green. Good signature

Charly
MacOS 10.5.6 - MacBook Intel C2Duo "Aluminum Late 2008"- GnuPG 1.4.9 -
GPG2 2.0.11 - Thunderbird 2.0.0.21+Enigmail 0.96a (20090412-1301) -
Apple's Mail+GPGMail 1.2.0 (v56), PGP key: 0xA57A8EFA

From hrickards at l33tmyst.com  Sun May  3 02:41:21 2009
From: hrickards at l33tmyst.com (Harry Rickards)
Date: Sun, 03 May 2009 10:41:21 +0100
Subject: [Enigmail] Color Coding
In-Reply-To: <0ML31I-1M0XiI1YhU-0000Bi@mrelayeu.kundenserver.de>
References: <49FD4607.7050600@l33tmyst.com>
	<0ML31I-1M0XiI1YhU-0000Bi@mrelayeu.kundenserver.de>
Message-ID: <49FD66C1.8080900@l33tmyst.com>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

Alexander Dahl wrote:
> Hi,
> 
>> Sorry if it's been asked before, but what trust level does a public key
>> have to have before the blue EnigMail bar turns to green? As far as I
>> can tell it seems to be Ultimately, but surely if you trusted someone
>> Fully the bar should turn to green? Also, is there anyway to change this
>> setting.
> 
> Trustlevel full is enough for green. You only set your very own key to
> ultimately. It's not relevant if the computed or user set trustlevel is
> full, if any of them (or both) the bar turns green.
> 
> Be sure to set the user trust level to full only for users you really
> trust. There was a discussion about this on this mailing list just a few
> days ago.
> 

Ok thanks. I've set the trust level of my mail user (I got emails with
the memory usage, GPG encrypted every 15 mins) to 3 (Fully). However I
then get a blue bar with:

Decrypted message; UNTRUSTED Good signature from l33tmyst (Mail Server
User) <mail at l33tmyst.com
Key ID: 0x3D958B68 / Signed on: 03/05/09 10:15

Do I have to sign the key to get it to turn green like Charly Avital did
in the example (see
http://www.mozdev.org/pipermail/enigmail/2009-May/011080.html)?

- --
Many thanks
Harry Rickards (a.k.a l33tmyst)

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From post at lespocky.de  Sun May  3 03:17:46 2009
From: post at lespocky.de (Alexander Dahl)
Date: Sun, 03 May 2009 12:17:46 +0200
Subject: [Enigmail] Color Coding
In-Reply-To: <49FD66C1.8080900@l33tmyst.com>
References: <49FD4607.7050600@l33tmyst.com>	<0ML31I-1M0XiI1YhU-0000Bi@mrelayeu.kundenserver.de>
	<49FD66C1.8080900@l33tmyst.com>
Message-ID: <0ML31I-1M0Ylv0ykQ-0000Qr@mrelayeu.kundenserver.de>

Hi,

> Ok thanks. I've set the trust level of my mail user (I got emails with
> the memory usage, GPG encrypted every 15 mins) to 3 (Fully). However I
> then get a blue bar with:
> 
> Decrypted message; UNTRUSTED Good signature from l33tmyst (Mail Server
> User) <mail at l33tmyst.com
> Key ID: 0x3D958B68 / Signed on: 03/05/09 10:15

You are right. I thought, um, sorry, I wrote from memory without
rechecking. *blush*

> Do I have to sign the key to get it to turn green like Charly Avital did
> in the example (see
> http://www.mozdev.org/pipermail/enigmail/2009-May/011080.html)?

So it's _your_ mail user? A second key of your own? A key you can verify
and trust? (should be the case when you created the key yourself.) Then
sign it with your primary key. This should give you a green bar.

Greets
Alex

-- 
***** http://www.lespocky.de *******************************************
Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase
a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety.
                                (Benjamin Franklin)

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From hrickards at l33tmyst.com  Sun May  3 03:43:51 2009
From: hrickards at l33tmyst.com (Harry Rickards)
Date: Sun, 03 May 2009 11:43:51 +0100
Subject: [Enigmail] Color Coding
In-Reply-To: <0ML31I-1M0Ylv0ykQ-0000Qr@mrelayeu.kundenserver.de>
References: <49FD4607.7050600@l33tmyst.com>	<0ML31I-1M0XiI1YhU-0000Bi@mrelayeu.kundenserver.de>	<49FD66C1.8080900@l33tmyst.com>
	<0ML31I-1M0Ylv0ykQ-0000Qr@mrelayeu.kundenserver.de>
Message-ID: <49FD7567.1050701@l33tmyst.com>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

Alexander Dahl wrote:
> Hi,
> 
>> Ok thanks. I've set the trust level of my mail user (I got emails with
>> the memory usage, GPG encrypted every 15 mins) to 3 (Fully). However I
>> then get a blue bar with:
>>
>> Decrypted message; UNTRUSTED Good signature from l33tmyst (Mail Server
>> User) <mail at l33tmyst.com
>> Key ID: 0x3D958B68 / Signed on: 03/05/09 10:15
> 
> You are right. I thought, um, sorry, I wrote from memory without
> rechecking. *blush*
> 
>> Do I have to sign the key to get it to turn green like Charly Avital did
>> in the example (see
>> http://www.mozdev.org/pipermail/enigmail/2009-May/011080.html)?
> 
> So it's _your_ mail user? A second key of your own? A key you can verify
> and trust? (should be the case when you created the key yourself.) Then
> sign it with your primary key. This should give you a green bar.
> 


Thanks, I've signed it and it gives me a green bar. The key is in my
name, but it's not for my email address. I get the user 'mail' to send
me the memory usage of my server, GPG encrypted with it's own key. To do
that I tell cron to run the following command as 'mail'.

free -m|/usr/bin/gpg -a --encrypt --sign --recipient
hrickards at l33tmyst.com|mail -s "Memory Usage (GPG Encrypted)"
hrickards at l33tmyst.com


- --
Many thanks
Harry Rickards (a.k.a l33tmyst)

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Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org

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From jmoore3rd at bellsouth.net  Sun May  3 04:51:23 2009
From: jmoore3rd at bellsouth.net (John W. Moore III)
Date: Sun, 03 May 2009 07:51:23 -0400
Subject: [Enigmail] Color Coding
In-Reply-To: <49FD66C1.8080900@l33tmyst.com>
References: <49FD4607.7050600@l33tmyst.com>	<0ML31I-1M0XiI1YhU-0000Bi@mrelayeu.kundenserver.de>
	<49FD66C1.8080900@l33tmyst.com>
Message-ID: <49FD853B.6090700@bellsouth.net>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA512

Harry Rickards wrote:

> Do I have to sign the key to get it to turn green like Charly Avital did
> in the example (see
> http://www.mozdev.org/pipermail/enigmail/2009-May/011080.html)?

Yep, but only with a Local [non-exportable] Signature.

JOHN 8-)
Timestamp: Sunday 03 May 2009, 07:51  --400 (Eastern Daylight Time)
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
Version: GnuPG v1.4.10-svn4987: (MingW32)
Comment: Public Key at:  http://tinyurl.com/8cpho
Comment: Gossamer Spider Web of Trust: https://www.gswot.org
Comment: Homepage:  http://tinyurl.com/yzhbhx

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=OBa0
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From hrickards at l33tmyst.com  Sun May  3 04:54:37 2009
From: hrickards at l33tmyst.com (Harry Rickards)
Date: Sun, 03 May 2009 12:54:37 +0100
Subject: [Enigmail] Color Coding
In-Reply-To: <49FD853B.6090700@bellsouth.net>
References: <49FD4607.7050600@l33tmyst.com>	<0ML31I-1M0XiI1YhU-0000Bi@mrelayeu.kundenserver.de>	<49FD66C1.8080900@l33tmyst.com>
	<49FD853B.6090700@bellsouth.net>
Message-ID: <49FD85FD.7030200@l33tmyst.com>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

John W. Moore III wrote:
> Harry Rickards wrote:
> 
>> Do I have to sign the key to get it to turn green like Charly Avital did
>> in the example (see
>> http://www.mozdev.org/pipermail/enigmail/2009-May/011080.html)?
> 
> Yep, but only with a Local [non-exportable] Signature.
> 
> JOHN 8-)
> Timestamp: Sunday 03 May 2009, 07:51  --400 (Eastern Daylight Time)

Ok, thanks. If the bar turns green when I sign it it's not that much of
a big deal, but do you know if there's anyway so that if the key is
*not* signed, but is trusted fully the bar turns green?

- --
Many thanks
Harry Rickards (a.k.a l33tmyst)

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Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org

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From jmoore3rd at bellsouth.net  Sun May  3 05:12:57 2009
From: jmoore3rd at bellsouth.net (John W. Moore III)
Date: Sun, 03 May 2009 08:12:57 -0400
Subject: [Enigmail] Color Coding
In-Reply-To: <49FD85FD.7030200@l33tmyst.com>
References: <49FD4607.7050600@l33tmyst.com>	<0ML31I-1M0XiI1YhU-0000Bi@mrelayeu.kundenserver.de>	<49FD66C1.8080900@l33tmyst.com>	<49FD853B.6090700@bellsouth.net>
	<49FD85FD.7030200@l33tmyst.com>
Message-ID: <49FD8A49.5020103@bellsouth.net>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA512

Harry Rickards wrote:

> Ok, thanks. If the bar turns green when I sign it it's not that much of
> a big deal, but do you know if there's anyway so that if the key is
> *not* signed, but is trusted fully the bar turns green?

This will entail a description of Depth of Trust.  By that I mean that
if You are verifying the Sig on a message made with a Key that You have
_not_ Signed but the Key is Signed by another Key on Your Keyring that
You have Trust Signed with a Depth of Trust greater than Zero then the
Enigmail Bar will show Green.  Depth of Trust indicated how many 'hops'
or 'ripples in the Trust pool' Your Signature extends.

i.e.  I tsign Your Key with a Depth of Trust of 2 then You sign Alice's
Key.  I haven't Signed Alice's Key yet when I receive a Signature from
Alice the Enigmail Bar will show Green because I signed Your Key & You
have signed Alice's.  If I receive a Message from someone whose Key has
been signed by Alice the same thing will occur.  This is because the
'hops' are 2 Sigs away from My Key.  If I had Signed  Your Key with a
Depth of Trust of 1 then only Keys Signed by Your Key will show Green
but Sigs made by folks whose Key You have Signed will show Blue because
I haven't indicated via My Trust signature that I am extending Trust by
proxy beyond Your Signature.

Clear as Mud?  You can also read the GnuPG Manual regarding the tsign
Command.  In PGP this is indicated by looking at the Signatures on a
Key.  Standard/Normal exportable sigs have a Trust Depth of 0 and will
be indicated with a Yellow Pencil but Trust Sigs [PGP calls 'em Trusted
Introducer] will be indicated with a Black Pencil.

Owner Trust is determined by the simple presence of Your Signature on a
Key.  Calculated Trust is determined based upon the Depth of Trust
extending from a Signature on the Key being verified.

HTH

JOHN ;)
Timestamp: Sunday 03 May 2009, 08:12  --400 (Eastern Daylight Time)
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
Version: GnuPG v1.4.10-svn4987: (MingW32)
Comment: Public Key at:  http://tinyurl.com/8cpho
Comment: Gossamer Spider Web of Trust: https://www.gswot.org
Comment: Homepage:  http://tinyurl.com/yzhbhx

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From hrickards at l33tmyst.com  Sun May  3 05:34:43 2009
From: hrickards at l33tmyst.com (Harry Rickards)
Date: Sun, 03 May 2009 13:34:43 +0100
Subject: [Enigmail] Color Coding
In-Reply-To: <49FD8A49.5020103@bellsouth.net>
References: <49FD4607.7050600@l33tmyst.com>	<0ML31I-1M0XiI1YhU-0000Bi@mrelayeu.kundenserver.de>	<49FD66C1.8080900@l33tmyst.com>	<49FD853B.6090700@bellsouth.net>	<49FD85FD.7030200@l33tmyst.com>
	<49FD8A49.5020103@bellsouth.net>
Message-ID: <49FD8F63.6010207@l33tmyst.com>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

John W. Moore III wrote:
> Harry Rickards wrote:
> 
>> Ok, thanks. If the bar turns green when I sign it it's not that much of
>> a big deal, but do you know if there's anyway so that if the key is
>> *not* signed, but is trusted fully the bar turns green?
> 
> This will entail a description of Depth of Trust.  By that I mean that
> if You are verifying the Sig on a message made with a Key that You have
> _not_ Signed but the Key is Signed by another Key on Your Keyring that
> You have Trust Signed with a Depth of Trust greater than Zero then the
> Enigmail Bar will show Green.  Depth of Trust indicated how many 'hops'
> or 'ripples in the Trust pool' Your Signature extends.
> 
> i.e.  I tsign Your Key with a Depth of Trust of 2 then You sign Alice's
> Key.  I haven't Signed Alice's Key yet when I receive a Signature from
> Alice the Enigmail Bar will show Green because I signed Your Key & You
> have signed Alice's.  If I receive a Message from someone whose Key has
> been signed by Alice the same thing will occur.  This is because the
> 'hops' are 2 Sigs away from My Key.  If I had Signed  Your Key with a
> Depth of Trust of 1 then only Keys Signed by Your Key will show Green
> but Sigs made by folks whose Key You have Signed will show Blue because
> I haven't indicated via My Trust signature that I am extending Trust by
> proxy beyond Your Signature.
> 
> Clear as Mud?  You can also read the GnuPG Manual regarding the tsign
> Command.  In PGP this is indicated by looking at the Signatures on a
> Key.  Standard/Normal exportable sigs have a Trust Depth of 0 and will
> be indicated with a Yellow Pencil but Trust Sigs [PGP calls 'em Trusted
> Introducer] will be indicated with a Black Pencil.
> 
> Owner Trust is determined by the simple presence of Your Signature on a
> Key.  Calculated Trust is determined based upon the Depth of Trust
> extending from a Signature on the Key being verified.
> 
> HTH
> 
> JOHN ;)
> Timestamp: Sunday 03 May 2009, 08:12  --400 (Eastern Daylight Time)

Ok, thanks for the explanation. That clears my problem up.

- --
Many thanks
Harry Rickards (a.k.a l33tmyst)

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From post at lespocky.de  Sun May  3 05:48:20 2009
From: post at lespocky.de (Alexander Dahl)
Date: Sun, 03 May 2009 14:48:20 +0200
Subject: [Enigmail] Color Coding
In-Reply-To: <49FD85FD.7030200@l33tmyst.com>
References: <49FD4607.7050600@l33tmyst.com>	<0ML31I-1M0XiI1YhU-0000Bi@mrelayeu.kundenserver.de>	<49FD66C1.8080900@l33tmyst.com>	<49FD853B.6090700@bellsouth.net>
	<49FD85FD.7030200@l33tmyst.com>
Message-ID: <0MKv5w-1M0b7d3Jzi-0001N2@mrelayeu.kundenserver.de>

Hi,

> Ok, thanks. If the bar turns green when I sign it it's not that much of
> a big deal, but do you know if there's anyway so that if the key is
> *not* signed, but is trusted fully the bar turns green?

If it's not signed at all, the bar will never get green.

It's possible to get green, if it's not signed by you. Due to the web of
trust it's possible that the calculated trust value will be enough for
full trust. I don't know the exact tresholds but I can draw how it works:

Person A trusts and signs the keys of B, C and D. Person B, C and D
trust and sign the key of E. If enough of those connections exist, the
trust level of E for A will reach a point where a 'full trust' value is
calculated.

For example my Enigmail shows me full trust for Patrick Brunschwig
although we never met and I didn't sign his key. Look at
http://pgp.cs.uu.nl/paths/CC8710D0/to/E443D6D8.html -- this shows you
the trust paths from me to Patrick, two direct connections each with
only one intermediate person I met personally and signed the key.

Greets
Alex

-- 
***** http://www.lespocky.de *******************************************
Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase
a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety.
                                (Benjamin Franklin)

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From hrickards at l33tmyst.com  Sun May  3 05:50:40 2009
From: hrickards at l33tmyst.com (Harry Rickards)
Date: Sun, 03 May 2009 13:50:40 +0100
Subject: [Enigmail] Color Coding
In-Reply-To: <0MKv5w-1M0b7d3Jzi-0001N2@mrelayeu.kundenserver.de>
References: <49FD4607.7050600@l33tmyst.com>	<0ML31I-1M0XiI1YhU-0000Bi@mrelayeu.kundenserver.de>	<49FD66C1.8080900@l33tmyst.com>	<49FD853B.6090700@bellsouth.net>	<49FD85FD.7030200@l33tmyst.com>
	<0MKv5w-1M0b7d3Jzi-0001N2@mrelayeu.kundenserver.de>
Message-ID: <49FD9320.4050607@l33tmyst.com>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

Alexander Dahl wrote:
> Hi,
> 
>> Ok, thanks. If the bar turns green when I sign it it's not that much of
>> a big deal, but do you know if there's anyway so that if the key is
>> *not* signed, but is trusted fully the bar turns green?
> 
> If it's not signed at all, the bar will never get green.
> 
> It's possible to get green, if it's not signed by you. Due to the web of
> trust it's possible that the calculated trust value will be enough for
> full trust. I don't know the exact tresholds but I can draw how it works:
> 
> Person A trusts and signs the keys of B, C and D. Person B, C and D
> trust and sign the key of E. If enough of those connections exist, the
> trust level of E for A will reach a point where a 'full trust' value is
> calculated.
> 
> For example my Enigmail shows me full trust for Patrick Brunschwig
> although we never met and I didn't sign his key. Look at
> http://pgp.cs.uu.nl/paths/CC8710D0/to/E443D6D8.html -- this shows you
> the trust paths from me to Patrick, two direct connections each with
> only one intermediate person I met personally and signed the key.


Thanks, your's and John W Moore III's explanation's helped me understand
the Web of Trust Idea.



- --
Many thanks
Harry Rickards (a.k.a l33tmyst)

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From patrick at mozilla-enigmail.org  Sun May  3 10:59:35 2009
From: patrick at mozilla-enigmail.org (Patrick Brunschwig)
Date: Sun, 03 May 2009 19:59:35 +0200
Subject: [Enigmail] Encrypt newsposts
In-Reply-To: <49FAAAD2.4020305@hajo-kirchhoff.de>
References: <49F9ACC4.30500@hajo-kirchhoff.de>	<49F9F440.6070904@bellsouth.net>	<49FA9518.9090102@hajo-kirchhoff.de>	<49FA9EDB.9000805@sixdemonbag.org>
	<49FAAAD2.4020305@hajo-kirchhoff.de>
Message-ID: <49FDDB87.60605@mozilla-enigmail.org>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA256

mailinglists wrote:
> Hi Robert,
>>> my problem is that enigmail refuses to encrypt posts. Actively refuses.
>>>     
>> This is not an Enigmail defect, the same way that it's not a defect for
>> a pistol to refuse to fire if the safety is on.  
> I didn't think it was a defect, I thought enigmail was being overly
> protective. My question is, how do I disable safety? I know what I am
> doing and don't (always) want a tool protecting me from myself.

The only way today is to change the code. The rule is there and always
checked, but I think a warning would do as well, since there are really
exceptions to the rule.

If you file a bug at bugzilla.mozdev.org, I might add some option that
would allow to overcome this situation.

- -Patrick
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From faramir.cl at gmail.com  Sun May  3 21:08:46 2009
From: faramir.cl at gmail.com (Faramir)
Date: Mon, 04 May 2009 00:08:46 -0400
Subject: [Enigmail] Color Coding
In-Reply-To: <49FD60DB.5070300@mac.com>
References: <49FD4607.7050600@l33tmyst.com> <49FD60DB.5070300@mac.com>
Message-ID: <49FE6A4E.10508@gmail.com>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA256

Charly Avital escribi?:
> Harry Rickards wrote the following on 5/3/09 3:21 AM:
>> Sorry if it's been asked before, but what trust level does a public key
>> have to have before the blue EnigMail bar turns to green? As far as I

  I think all it needs is your signature on it... but you should be
careful at the moment of issuing signatures. I use mostly local
signatures, when I need to encrypt to a key. But now I know I don't need
to do that, I won't issue local signatures either, unless I really need
to do it.

  Best Regards
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
Version: GnuPG v1.4.9 (MingW32)
Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org

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From faramir.cl at gmail.com  Sun May  3 22:26:47 2009
From: faramir.cl at gmail.com (Faramir)
Date: Mon, 04 May 2009 01:26:47 -0400
Subject: [Enigmail] Color Coding
In-Reply-To: <49FD85FD.7030200@l33tmyst.com>
References: <49FD4607.7050600@l33tmyst.com>	<0ML31I-1M0XiI1YhU-0000Bi@mrelayeu.kundenserver.de>	<49FD66C1.8080900@l33tmyst.com>	<49FD853B.6090700@bellsouth.net>
	<49FD85FD.7030200@l33tmyst.com>
Message-ID: <49FE7C97.80303@gmail.com>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA256

Harry Rickards escribi?:

> Ok, thanks. If the bar turns green when I sign it it's not that much of
> a big deal, but do you know if there's anyway so that if the key is
> *not* signed, but is trusted fully the bar turns green?

  I think if you fully trust a key belonging to the one that is supposed
to belong, you should sign it, even if you use a local non-exportable
signature. But that's just my humble opinion...

  Best Regards
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Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org

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From m534c.subscribe at gmail.com  Mon May  4 05:09:57 2009
From: m534c.subscribe at gmail.com (Jonas Islander)
Date: Mon, 04 May 2009 14:09:57 +0200
Subject: [Enigmail] Encrypt newsposts
In-Reply-To: <49FA9F0A.5030804@Mozilla-Enigmail.org>
References: <49F9ACC4.30500@hajo-kirchhoff.de>
	<49F9F440.6070904@bellsouth.net>	<49FA9518.9090102@hajo-kirchhoff.de>
	<49FA9F0A.5030804@Mozilla-Enigmail.org>
Message-ID: <49FEDB15.1040509@gmail.com>

John Clizbe wrote:

> I'm going to go out on a limb and say Enigmail is "Doing The Right
> Thing(tm)". This is probably the only time I've ever seen mention of
> encrypting news, so I don't think Enigmail should be changed to allow
> it. It's an outlier behavior.
>   

Sorry for barging in on the discussion, but would this feature make sense:

If a key ID contains a nntp: URL instead of an email address, Enigmail
encrypts posts to that news server using that key.

This could be used to ensure safe transport and storage of news, without
the need to leave any keys on the server. So you could, for example, use
a hosted news server without compromising security.

-- 
Jonas Islander


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From rjh at sixdemonbag.org  Tue May  5 07:08:55 2009
From: rjh at sixdemonbag.org (Robert J. Hansen)
Date: Tue, 05 May 2009 10:08:55 -0400
Subject: [Enigmail] Enigmail on Ubuntu 9.04
Message-ID: <4A004877.5060609@sixdemonbag.org>

Since upgrading to Ubuntu 9.04, I've discovered a weird behavior:
despite having my passphrase cache set to a nice high value, Enigmail
refuses to cache my passphrase for any length of time.  Each and every
encrypted email I receive requires me to re-enter a passphrase all over
again.

This occurs using official Ubuntu packages.

Anyone know what's going on?

From andy.ruddock at rainydayz.org  Tue May  5 07:16:11 2009
From: andy.ruddock at rainydayz.org (Andy Ruddock)
Date: Tue, 05 May 2009 16:16:11 +0200
Subject: [Enigmail] Enigmail on Ubuntu 9.04
In-Reply-To: <4A004877.5060609@sixdemonbag.org>
References: <4A004877.5060609@sixdemonbag.org>
Message-ID: <4A004A2B.7020507@rainydayz.org>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

Robert J. Hansen wrote:
> Since upgrading to Ubuntu 9.04, I've discovered a weird behavior:
> despite having my passphrase cache set to a nice high value, Enigmail
> refuses to cache my passphrase for any length of time.  Each and every
> encrypted email I receive requires me to re-enter a passphrase all over
> again.
> 
> This occurs using official Ubuntu packages.
> 
> Anyone know what's going on?
> _______________________________________________
> Enigmail mailing list
> Enigmail at mozdev.org
> https://www.mozdev.org/mailman/listinfo/enigmail

Irritating isn't it!

If you click through
  System -> Preferences -> Encryption and Keyrings
you'll get a dialog with two tabs, in the PGP Passphrases tab you can
set the length of time that passphrases are cached for.

Initially it's turned off, but the default setting for it when on is 300
minutes - which is a ludicrously long period of time.

Not sure, but this setting may depend upon whether gpg-agent or seahorse
is used for passphrase caching.

- --
Andy Ruddock
- ------------
andy.ruddock at rainydayz.org (GPG Key ID 0xA622D452)
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
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Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org

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From ludovic at mozillamessaging.com  Tue May  5 07:16:31 2009
From: ludovic at mozillamessaging.com (Ludovic Hirlimann)
Date: Tue, 05 May 2009 16:16:31 +0200
Subject: [Enigmail] Enigmail on Ubuntu 9.04
In-Reply-To: <4A004877.5060609@sixdemonbag.org>
References: <4A004877.5060609@sixdemonbag.org>
Message-ID: <4A004A3F.2080004@mozillamessaging.com>

On 5/5/09 4:08 PM, Robert J. Hansen wrote:
> Since upgrading to Ubuntu 9.04, I've discovered a weird behavior:
> [snip]
> Anyone know what's going on?
>
>    
Did you ask the package maintainer ?

Ludo

-- 
Ludovic Hirlimann MozillaMessaging QA lead
http://www.spreadthunderbird.com/aff/79/2


From rjh at sixdemonbag.org  Tue May  5 07:37:38 2009
From: rjh at sixdemonbag.org (Robert J. Hansen)
Date: Tue, 05 May 2009 10:37:38 -0400
Subject: [Enigmail] Enigmail on Ubuntu 9.04
In-Reply-To: <4A004A2B.7020507@rainydayz.org>
References: <4A004877.5060609@sixdemonbag.org> <4A004A2B.7020507@rainydayz.org>
Message-ID: <4A004F32.1000201@sixdemonbag.org>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA256

Andy Ruddock wrote:
> Irritating isn't it!

Thank you, Andy.  This definitely should be entered in Launchpad as a
bug against Enigmail.  If Ubuntu is going to have their Enigmail package
use their own passphrase manager, Ubuntu should also remove from
Enigmail all passphrase caching options -- otherwise users will just get
mighty confused.

Would you like to enter this one, or shall I?


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From patrick at mozilla-enigmail.org  Tue May  5 07:53:03 2009
From: patrick at mozilla-enigmail.org (Patrick Brunschwig)
Date: Tue, 05 May 2009 16:53:03 +0200
Subject: [Enigmail] Enigmail on Ubuntu 9.04
In-Reply-To: <4A004F32.1000201@sixdemonbag.org>
References: <4A004877.5060609@sixdemonbag.org> <4A004A2B.7020507@rainydayz.org>
	<4A004F32.1000201@sixdemonbag.org>
Message-ID: <4A0052CF.90302@mozilla-enigmail.org>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA256

Robert J. Hansen wrote:
> Andy Ruddock wrote:
>> Irritating isn't it!
> 
> Thank you, Andy.  This definitely should be entered in Launchpad as a
> bug against Enigmail.  If Ubuntu is going to have their Enigmail package
> use their own passphrase manager, Ubuntu should also remove from
> Enigmail all passphrase caching options -- otherwise users will just get
> mighty confused.
> 
> Would you like to enter this one, or shall I?


No, it's not a bug of any system. It's simply the "problem" that Ubunutu
starts gpg-agent (or actually seahorse-agent) at login, which is
obviously before Thunderbird/Enigmail. If Enigmail detects a gpg-agent,
then it uses the agent and the idle times are irrelevant (because
Enigmail has no control over gpg-agent).

See also bug 20873 <https://www.mozdev.org/bugs/show_bug.cgi?id=20873>

The only solution I have (implemented in trunk) is to warn that
gpg-agent might use different idle time settings.

- -Patrick
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
Version: GnuPG v2.0.11 (GNU/Linux)
Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/

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From l.dobrev at gmail.com  Tue May  5 08:12:21 2009
From: l.dobrev at gmail.com (Lachezar Dobrev)
Date: Tue, 5 May 2009 18:12:21 +0300
Subject: [Enigmail] Enigmail on Ubuntu 9.04
In-Reply-To: <4A004877.5060609@sixdemonbag.org>
References: <4A004877.5060609@sixdemonbag.org>
Message-ID: <90266c3f0905050812r75a1d6du260dc9376d1bffbc@mail.gmail.com>

  I found out, that integrating with Ubuntu is the better option.
  1. In the User Settings open the Encryption/Keyring options (sorry,
using non-English interface)
  2. Choose there to remember the password for let's say 300 seconds
(5 minutes).
  3. Un-check the 'Ask before using remembered...'
  4. In Thunderbird open Enigmail's settings.
  5. Turn on the 'Do not ask for any passphrase'.
  6. Turn on the 'Display expert settings'
  7. Select OK.
  8. Open Engimail settings again.
  9. Go to Advanced tab.
 10. Turn on 'Use gpg-agent for passphrases'.

  A defect occurs, if you have visual effects turned on: when the
password question pop-up occurs it is often displayed behind the
Enigmail window, but has focus.

2009/5/5 Robert J. Hansen <rjh at sixdemonbag.org>:
> Since upgrading to Ubuntu 9.04, I've discovered a weird behavior:
> despite having my passphrase cache set to a nice high value, Enigmail
> refuses to cache my passphrase for any length of time. ?Each and every
> encrypted email I receive requires me to re-enter a passphrase all over
> again.
>
> This occurs using official Ubuntu packages.
>
> Anyone know what's going on?
> _______________________________________________
> Enigmail mailing list
> Enigmail at mozdev.org
> https://www.mozdev.org/mailman/listinfo/enigmail
>

From patrick at mozilla-enigmail.org  Tue May  5 08:19:41 2009
From: patrick at mozilla-enigmail.org (Patrick Brunschwig)
Date: Tue, 05 May 2009 17:19:41 +0200
Subject: [Enigmail] Enigmail on Ubuntu 9.04
In-Reply-To: <4A0052CF.90302@mozilla-enigmail.org>
References: <4A004877.5060609@sixdemonbag.org>
	<4A004A2B.7020507@rainydayz.org>	<4A004F32.1000201@sixdemonbag.org>
	<4A0052CF.90302@mozilla-enigmail.org>
Message-ID: <4A00590D.7090209@mozilla-enigmail.org>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA256

Patrick Brunschwig wrote:
> Robert J. Hansen wrote:
>> Andy Ruddock wrote:
>>> Irritating isn't it!
>> Thank you, Andy.  This definitely should be entered in Launchpad as a
>> bug against Enigmail.  If Ubuntu is going to have their Enigmail package
>> use their own passphrase manager, Ubuntu should also remove from
>> Enigmail all passphrase caching options -- otherwise users will just get
>> mighty confused.
> 
>> Would you like to enter this one, or shall I?
> 
> 
> No, it's not a bug of any system. It's simply the "problem" that Ubunutu
> starts gpg-agent (or actually seahorse-agent) at login, which is
> obviously before Thunderbird/Enigmail. If Enigmail detects a gpg-agent,
> then it uses the agent and the idle times are irrelevant (because
> Enigmail has no control over gpg-agent).
> 
> See also bug 20873 <https://www.mozdev.org/bugs/show_bug.cgi?id=20873>
> 
> The only solution I have (implemented in trunk) is to warn that
> gpg-agent might use different idle time settings.

I hate replying to myself, but I forgot one thing here: users are free
to disable gpg-agent (or seahorse-agent), therefore removing the
corresponding options from Enigmail in Ubuntu is a not a clever thing to do.

- -Patrick
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Version: GnuPG v2.0.11 (GNU/Linux)
Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/

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From dkg at fifthhorseman.net  Tue May  5 08:31:37 2009
From: dkg at fifthhorseman.net (Daniel Kahn Gillmor)
Date: Tue, 05 May 2009 11:31:37 -0400
Subject: [Enigmail] Interactions between gpg-agent and enigmail [was: Re:
 Enigmail on Ubuntu 9.04]
In-Reply-To: <4A00590D.7090209@mozilla-enigmail.org>
References: <4A004877.5060609@sixdemonbag.org>	<4A004A2B.7020507@rainydayz.org>	<4A004F32.1000201@sixdemonbag.org>	<4A0052CF.90302@mozilla-enigmail.org>
	<4A00590D.7090209@mozilla-enigmail.org>
Message-ID: <4A005BD9.8040501@fifthhorseman.net>

On 05/05/2009 11:19 AM, Patrick Brunschwig wrote:
> I hate replying to myself, but I forgot one thing here: users are free
> to disable gpg-agent (or seahorse-agent), therefore removing the
> corresponding options from Enigmail in Ubuntu is a not a clever thing to do.

Would it be possible for enigmail to detect whether or not the gpg-agent
is running?  On GNU/Linux at least, a simple examination of the
$GPG_AGENT_INFO environment variable should be sufficient.

According to gpg2(1):

>        GPG_AGENT_INFO
>               Used  to  locate  the  gpg-agent.  The value consists of 3 colon
>               delimited fields: The first is  the  path  to  the  Unix  Domain
>               Socket,  the  second  the  PID of the gpg-agent and the protocol
>               version which should be set to 1. When starting the gpg-agent as
>               described in its documentation, this variable is set to the cor?
>               rect value. The option --gpg-agent-info can be used to  override
>               it.

Maybe if enigmail detects that the agent is running, it could alter the
password caching preferences display to clarify the situation.

	--dkg

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From dkg at fifthhorseman.net  Tue May  5 09:01:07 2009
From: dkg at fifthhorseman.net (Daniel Kahn Gillmor)
Date: Tue, 05 May 2009 12:01:07 -0400
Subject: [Enigmail] MIME multipart/signed and the risk of followon MIME parts
Message-ID: <4A0062C3.7070505@fifthhorseman.net>

Hi Enigmail people--

I sign my messages with enigmail using PGP/MIME.

The messages start out like this (parts are labeled with letters for
later reference):

*-+ Content-Type: multipart/signed (X)
  +-- Content-Type: text/plain (Y)
  +-- Content-Type: application/pgp-signature (Z)

When i send messages to mailing lists (like this one), the list software
appears to wrap the whole thing in an additional MIME layer, so that it
looks like this:

*-+ Content-Type: multipart/mixed (A)
  +--+ Content-Type: multipart/signed (X)
  |  +-- Content-Type: text/plain (Y)
  |  +-- Content-Type: application/pgp-signature (Z)
  +-- Content-Type: text/plain (disposition: inline) (B)

(B) in this case is the mailing list footer.

My concern is that Enigmail validates the multipart/signed bit, and
displays the "Good signature from..." message, but *also* displays part
B (after a horizontal rule).

I know at this point that only the displayed material before the
horizontal rule is what's actually signed, but it seems to me like a
malicious MTA could just as easily inject nasty stuff there and casual
enigmail users would not realize that the stuff in (B) was not actually
signed by the author of the e-mail.

Any thoughts about how to make this distinction clearer in the UI?

	--dkg

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From dkg at fifthhorseman.net  Tue May  5 09:26:46 2009
From: dkg at fifthhorseman.net (Daniel Kahn Gillmor)
Date: Tue, 05 May 2009 12:26:46 -0400
Subject: [Enigmail] spoofability of inline-signed messages in enigmail
Message-ID: <4A0068C6.4010307@fifthhorseman.net>

When enigmail encounters an inline PGP signature, it replaces the header
and footer with: "********* *BEGIN ENCRYPTED or SIGNED PART* *********"
and "********** *END ENCRYPTED or SIGNED PART* **********" lines.

But these injections seem dubious due to their spoofability.  For
example, what's to stop an attacker from writing a cleartext message
that includes the same literal header and footer, and then appending a
legitimately inline-signed message to that?  In this modern era of
cruft-ridden top-posting, it would be pretty easy to sneak a copy of a
small, signed post by a given author somewhere into the body of the
forged message, and then to explicitly place the "*BEGIN ENCRYPTED or
SIGNED PART*" wrappers around text that you want to claim the person signed.

So if Dave wants to steal Alice's pet dog, he might send the following
forged message to the kennel holding the dog:

====8<====8<====8<====8<====8<====8<====8<====8<====8<====

From: Alice <alice at example.org>
To: Kennel <kennel at example.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

********* *BEGIN ENCRYPTED or SIGNED PART* *********

I, Alice, agree that Dave can take my pet spaniel since he promised to
take good care of him.

********** *END ENCRYPTED or SIGNED PART* **********

Dave wrote:

Alice, i wish you would reconsider.  I'll take good care of him, please!

Alice wrote earlier:

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA256

Dave, i'd really rather not part with my pet spaniel.

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
Version: GnuPG v2.0.11 (GNU/Linux)
Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/

iQEVAw33edsfencOpHodsOiwAQiCEAf/dSfhiQgqbkLedJYuyRweZIzMVj+FgobL
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cS/EEqaOFftqJknufZaYSLOHpSijo72EDNltVmTf/9XJXpqdM196FA==
=jjBc
-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----


====8<====8<====8<====8<====8<====8<====8<====8<====8<====

If the kennel at example.com is using enigmail to verify messages from
Alice, they may very well end up participating in a terrible dognapping
scheme!

Is there a way to avoid this kind of spoofing in the enigmail UI somehow?

	--dkg

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From dkg at fifthhorseman.net  Tue May  5 09:36:28 2009
From: dkg at fifthhorseman.net (Daniel Kahn Gillmor)
Date: Tue, 05 May 2009 12:36:28 -0400
Subject: [Enigmail] MIME multipart/signed and the risk of followon MIME
 parts
In-Reply-To: <4A0062C3.7070505@fifthhorseman.net>
References: <4A0062C3.7070505@fifthhorseman.net>
Message-ID: <4A006B0C.6090505@fifthhorseman.net>

it gets weirder!

On 05/05/2009 12:01 PM, Daniel Kahn Gillmor wrote:
> *-+ Content-Type: multipart/mixed (A)
>   +--+ Content-Type: multipart/signed (X)
>   |  +-- Content-Type: text/plain (Y)
>   |  +-- Content-Type: application/pgp-signature (Z)
>   +-- Content-Type: text/plain (disposition: inline) (B)
> 
> (B) in this case is the mailing list footer.

I tried crafting a message like this, but with additional injected text
(C) above the signed part (X):

*-+ Content-Type: multipart/mixed (A)
  +-- Content-Type: text/plain (disposition: inline) (C)
  +--+ Content-Type: multipart/signed (X)
  |  +-- Content-Type: text/plain (Y)
  |  +-- Content-Type: application/pgp-signature (Z)
  +-- Content-Type: text/plain (disposition: inline) (B)

In this case, icedove displays C<hr>Y<hr>B, but no enigmail header
appears at all, and the MUA does not appear to be aware that any part of
the message itself was signed.

Is this intentional?  What should enigmail do in this scenario where
only a section of the message is signed?

	--dkg

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From patrick at mozilla-enigmail.org  Tue May  5 23:46:40 2009
From: patrick at mozilla-enigmail.org (Patrick Brunschwig)
Date: Wed, 06 May 2009 08:46:40 +0200
Subject: [Enigmail] Interactions between gpg-agent and enigmail [was:
 Re: Enigmail on Ubuntu 9.04]
In-Reply-To: <4A005BD9.8040501@fifthhorseman.net>
References: <4A004877.5060609@sixdemonbag.org>	<4A004A2B.7020507@rainydayz.org>	<4A004F32.1000201@sixdemonbag.org>	<4A0052CF.90302@mozilla-enigmail.org>	<4A00590D.7090209@mozilla-enigmail.org>
	<4A005BD9.8040501@fifthhorseman.net>
Message-ID: <4A013250.90703@mozilla-enigmail.org>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA256

Daniel Kahn Gillmor wrote:
> On 05/05/2009 11:19 AM, Patrick Brunschwig wrote:
>> I hate replying to myself, but I forgot one thing here: users are free
>> to disable gpg-agent (or seahorse-agent), therefore removing the
>> corresponding options from Enigmail in Ubuntu is a not a clever thing to do.
> 
> Would it be possible for enigmail to detect whether or not the gpg-agent
> is running?  On GNU/Linux at least, a simple examination of the
> $GPG_AGENT_INFO environment variable should be sufficient.
> 
> According to gpg2(1):
> 
>>        GPG_AGENT_INFO
>>               Used  to  locate  the  gpg-agent.  The value consists of 3 colon
>>               delimited fields: The first is  the  path  to  the  Unix  Domain
>>               Socket,  the  second  the  PID of the gpg-agent and the protocol
>>               version which should be set to 1. When starting the gpg-agent as
>>               described in its documentation, this variable is set to the cor?
>>               rect value. The option --gpg-agent-info can be used to  override
>>               it.
> 
> Maybe if enigmail detects that the agent is running, it could alter the
> password caching preferences display to clarify the situation.

Right, Enigmail does that. The problem is that this is not sufficient. I
have seen many situations where e.g.GPG_AGENT_INFO was present, but no
gpg-agent was actually running,  or in the following situation: no
gpg-agent is used but the user chooses to use gpg v2.x. In this case,
Enigmail has to start a gpg-agent. As said, I have changed the
preferences dialog recently; the user is now alerted in case a gpg-agent
is detected that the idle times might not be respected.

- -Patrick
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
Version: GnuPG v2.0.11 (GNU/Linux)
Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/

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B7Irm2607+5OHd+3NE/cUa6spX80Yr9ikVHiRI3q4xX7eSAGhHhS5Q==
=tlrb
-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

From patrick at mozilla-enigmail.org  Tue May  5 23:49:28 2009
From: patrick at mozilla-enigmail.org (Patrick Brunschwig)
Date: Wed, 06 May 2009 08:49:28 +0200
Subject: [Enigmail] MIME multipart/signed and the risk of followon MIME
 parts
In-Reply-To: <4A006B0C.6090505@fifthhorseman.net>
References: <4A0062C3.7070505@fifthhorseman.net>
	<4A006B0C.6090505@fifthhorseman.net>
Message-ID: <4A0132F8.40603@mozilla-enigmail.org>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA256

Daniel Kahn Gillmor wrote:
> it gets weirder!
> 
> On 05/05/2009 12:01 PM, Daniel Kahn Gillmor wrote:
>> *-+ Content-Type: multipart/mixed (A)
>>   +--+ Content-Type: multipart/signed (X)
>>   |  +-- Content-Type: text/plain (Y)
>>   |  +-- Content-Type: application/pgp-signature (Z)
>>   +-- Content-Type: text/plain (disposition: inline) (B)
>>
>> (B) in this case is the mailing list footer.
> 
> I tried crafting a message like this, but with additional injected text
> (C) above the signed part (X):
> 
> *-+ Content-Type: multipart/mixed (A)
>   +-- Content-Type: text/plain (disposition: inline) (C)
>   +--+ Content-Type: multipart/signed (X)
>   |  +-- Content-Type: text/plain (Y)
>   |  +-- Content-Type: application/pgp-signature (Z)
>   +-- Content-Type: text/plain (disposition: inline) (B)
> 
> In this case, icedove displays C<hr>Y<hr>B, but no enigmail header
> appears at all, and the MUA does not appear to be aware that any part of
> the message itself was signed.
> 
> Is this intentional?  What should enigmail do in this scenario where
> only a section of the message is signed?

It's not intentional. The problem is that the MIME structure information
given by Thunderbird is insufficient, thus Enigmail can't detect the
signed part.

- -Patrick
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
Version: GnuPG v2.0.11 (GNU/Linux)
Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/

iQEVAwUBSgEy93cOpHodsOiwAQhv8wf/c8IJMN0SU298xmlsy+COxJy63xU7BjAn
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K6az3SuAq8EkPtFVvzpgUzNQKpm5rZqwdgw7ek6T1AWiKzwyGegtDg==
=eQLW
-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

From ludovic at mozillamessaging.com  Wed May  6 00:16:29 2009
From: ludovic at mozillamessaging.com (Ludovic Hirlimann)
Date: Wed, 06 May 2009 09:16:29 +0200
Subject: [Enigmail] MIME multipart/signed and the risk of followon MIME
 parts
In-Reply-To: <4A0132F8.40603@mozilla-enigmail.org>
References: <4A0062C3.7070505@fifthhorseman.net>	<4A006B0C.6090505@fifthhorseman.net>
	<4A0132F8.40603@mozilla-enigmail.org>
Message-ID: <4A01394D.2050905@mozillamessaging.com>

On 5/6/09 8:49 AM, Patrick Brunschwig wrote:
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA256
>
> Daniel Kahn Gillmor wrote:
>    
>> it gets weirder!
>>
>> On 05/05/2009 12:01 PM, Daniel Kahn Gillmor wrote:
>>      
>>> *-+ Content-Type: multipart/mixed (A)
>>>    +--+ Content-Type: multipart/signed (X)
>>>    |  +-- Content-Type: text/plain (Y)
>>>    |  +-- Content-Type: application/pgp-signature (Z)
>>>    +-- Content-Type: text/plain (disposition: inline) (B)
>>>
>>> (B) in this case is the mailing list footer.
>>>        
>> I tried crafting a message like this, but with additional injected text
>> (C) above the signed part (X):
>>
>> *-+ Content-Type: multipart/mixed (A)
>>    +-- Content-Type: text/plain (disposition: inline) (C)
>>    +--+ Content-Type: multipart/signed (X)
>>    |  +-- Content-Type: text/plain (Y)
>>    |  +-- Content-Type: application/pgp-signature (Z)
>>    +-- Content-Type: text/plain (disposition: inline) (B)
>>
>> In this case, icedove displays C<hr>Y<hr>B, but no enigmail header
>> appears at all, and the MUA does not appear to be aware that any part of
>> the message itself was signed.
>>
>> Is this intentional?  What should enigmail do in this scenario where
>> only a section of the message is signed?
>>      
> It's not intentional. The problem is that the MIME structure information
> given by Thunderbird is insufficient, thus Enigmail can't detect the
> signed part.
>
>    
What's the bug number for that ?

Ludovic


-- 
Ludovic Hirlimann MozillaMessaging QA lead
http://www.spreadthunderbird.com/aff/79/2


From patrick at mozilla-enigmail.org  Wed May  6 00:56:57 2009
From: patrick at mozilla-enigmail.org (Patrick Brunschwig)
Date: Wed, 06 May 2009 09:56:57 +0200
Subject: [Enigmail] MIME multipart/signed and the risk of followon MIME
 parts
In-Reply-To: <4A01394D.2050905@mozillamessaging.com>
References: <4A0062C3.7070505@fifthhorseman.net>	<4A006B0C.6090505@fifthhorseman.net>	<4A0132F8.40603@mozilla-enigmail.org>
	<4A01394D.2050905@mozillamessaging.com>
Message-ID: <4A0142C9.7000202@mozilla-enigmail.org>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA256

Ludovic Hirlimann wrote:
> On 5/6/09 8:49 AM, Patrick Brunschwig wrote:
>> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
>> Hash: SHA256
>>
>> Daniel Kahn Gillmor wrote:
>>   
>>> it gets weirder!
>>>
>>> On 05/05/2009 12:01 PM, Daniel Kahn Gillmor wrote:
>>>     
>>>> *-+ Content-Type: multipart/mixed (A)
>>>>    +--+ Content-Type: multipart/signed (X)
>>>>    |  +-- Content-Type: text/plain (Y)
>>>>    |  +-- Content-Type: application/pgp-signature (Z)
>>>>    +-- Content-Type: text/plain (disposition: inline) (B)
>>>>
>>>> (B) in this case is the mailing list footer.
>>>>        
>>> I tried crafting a message like this, but with additional injected text
>>> (C) above the signed part (X):
>>>
>>> *-+ Content-Type: multipart/mixed (A)
>>>    +-- Content-Type: text/plain (disposition: inline) (C)
>>>    +--+ Content-Type: multipart/signed (X)
>>>    |  +-- Content-Type: text/plain (Y)
>>>    |  +-- Content-Type: application/pgp-signature (Z)
>>>    +-- Content-Type: text/plain (disposition: inline) (B)
>>>
>>> In this case, icedove displays C<hr>Y<hr>B, but no enigmail header
>>> appears at all, and the MUA does not appear to be aware that any part of
>>> the message itself was signed.
>>>
>>> Is this intentional?  What should enigmail do in this scenario where
>>> only a section of the message is signed?
>>>      
>> It's not intentional. The problem is that the MIME structure information
>> given by Thunderbird is insufficient, thus Enigmail can't detect the
>> signed part.
>>
>>    
> What's the bug number for that ?

Some of the bugs are 235482 and 248846. The problem is that there is no
reasonable interface to walk through the MIME parts of a message. See
also <https://wiki.mozilla.org/User:Jminta/Steel#steelIMessage>,
especially the comments related to steelIMessage.

- -Patrick
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
Version: GnuPG v2.0.11 (GNU/Linux)
Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/

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=0dO5
-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

From thomas at lecavelier.name  Wed May  6 02:53:21 2009
From: thomas at lecavelier.name (Thomas Lecavelier)
Date: Wed, 06 May 2009 11:53:21 +0200
Subject: [Enigmail] Enigmail freeze when verify
Message-ID: <gtrmmj$1chh$1@mozdev.mozdev.org>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

Hi there.

I'm running :
* TB 2.0.0.21 (ubuntu Intrepid Ibex package)
* Engimail 0.95.7 (xpi from mozdev.org)
* GPG v1.4.9

Everything worked great since I setup that box, but two weeks ago,
enigmail start freezing when verifying signatures. When I'm having a
look to my processes, I see gpg still running in back, called with such
a command:

/usr/bin/gpg --charset utf8 --batch --no-tty --status-fd 2 --verify

The process is sleeping and awakable (SL)

The only way to recover my thunderbird is to SIGKILL that process.

Every other function is working (signing work great, fetching key from
keyservers too).

Am I the only one meeting that problem? Is there an incompatibilty
between some of my tools?

Thank you by advance.
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
Version: GnuPG v1.4.9 (GNU/Linux)
Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org

iEYEARECAAYFAkoBXhEACgkQHOrSzJHr6r142gCcCl5vlmj7CrCOb/lBRiYKdv2h
cz0An3cIf118qZME54OY1EEoFeAh/rKl
=nqHC
-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

From patrick at mozilla-enigmail.org  Wed May  6 04:15:57 2009
From: patrick at mozilla-enigmail.org (Patrick Brunschwig)
Date: Wed, 06 May 2009 13:15:57 +0200
Subject: [Enigmail] Enigmail freeze when verify
In-Reply-To: <gtrmmj$1chh$1@mozdev.mozdev.org>
References: <gtrmmj$1chh$1@mozdev.mozdev.org>
Message-ID: <4A01716D.8080903@mozilla-enigmail.org>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA256

Thomas Lecavelier wrote:
> Hi there.
> 
> I'm running :
> * TB 2.0.0.21 (ubuntu Intrepid Ibex package)
> * Engimail 0.95.7 (xpi from mozdev.org)
> * GPG v1.4.9
> 
> Everything worked great since I setup that box, but two weeks ago,
> enigmail start freezing when verifying signatures. When I'm having a
> look to my processes, I see gpg still running in back, called with such
> a command:
> 
> /usr/bin/gpg --charset utf8 --batch --no-tty --status-fd 2 --verify
> 
> The process is sleeping and awakable (SL)
> 
> The only way to recover my thunderbird is to SIGKILL that process.
> 
> Every other function is working (signing work great, fetching key from
> keyservers too).
> 
> Am I the only one meeting that problem? Is there an incompatibilty
> between some of my tools?

I don't think that using TB from Ubuntu together with Enigmail from
mozdev.org is a good combination to use, in general I would expect some
incompatibility from this combination.

Maybe you could try to verify a message directly on the command line to
see the output from gpg? E.g. start gpg with the command line above and
copy&paste the source of this message to the command line.

- -Patrick
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
Version: GnuPG v2.0.11 (GNU/Linux)
Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/

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l0oVMjF+hkbMMtEr6botuzRn8Qkfk1wizQy53bMHJCb6GbeBXxppuw==
=wexP
-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

From zins at gmx.net  Wed May  6 04:59:20 2009
From: zins at gmx.net (Ludwig Zins)
Date: Wed, 06 May 2009 13:59:20 +0200
Subject: [Enigmail] Enigmail freeze when verify
In-Reply-To: <4A01716D.8080903@mozilla-enigmail.org>
References: <gtrmmj$1chh$1@mozdev.mozdev.org>
	<4A01716D.8080903@mozilla-enigmail.org>
Message-ID: <4A017B98.6030105@gmx.net>



Patrick Brunschwig schrieb:
> Thomas Lecavelier wrote:
>> Hi there.
> 
>> I'm running :
>> * TB 2.0.0.21 (ubuntu Intrepid Ibex package)
>> * Engimail 0.95.7 (xpi from mozdev.org)
>> * GPG v1.4.9
> 
>> Everything worked great since I setup that box, but two weeks ago,
>> enigmail start freezing when verifying signatures. When I'm having a
>> look to my processes, I see gpg still running in back, called with such
>> a command:
> 
>> /usr/bin/gpg --charset utf8 --batch --no-tty --status-fd 2 --verify
> 
>> The process is sleeping and awakable (SL)
> 
>> The only way to recover my thunderbird is to SIGKILL that process.
> 
>> Every other function is working (signing work great, fetching key from
>> keyservers too).
> 
>> Am I the only one meeting that problem? Is there an incompatibilty
>> between some of my tools?
> 
> I don't think that using TB from Ubuntu together with Enigmail from
> mozdev.org is a good combination to use, in general I would expect some
> incompatibility from this combination.
> 
> Maybe you could try to verify a message directly on the command line to
> see the output from gpg? E.g. start gpg with the command line above and
> copy&paste the source of this message to the command line.
> 
> -Patrick

May you try the ubuntu-Package of enigmail:

sudo apt-get install mozilla-thunderbird-enigmail

Ludwig
_______________________________________________
Enigmail mailing list
Enigmail at mozdev.org
https://www.mozdev.org/mailman/listinfo/enigmail

-- 
Ludwig Zins
85276 Pfaffenhofen - Germany
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
GnuPG/PGP:
KeyID: 0x6FC1C8BF
Keyserver: http://pgpkeys.pca.dfn.de/
-----------------------------------------------------------------------

 ()  This is Sch?uble. Copy Sch?uble into your signature
/||\ to help him on his way to ?berwachungsstaat.
|UU|

-

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From thomas at lecavelier.name  Wed May  6 05:03:16 2009
From: thomas at lecavelier.name (Thomas Lecavelier)
Date: Wed, 06 May 2009 14:03:16 +0200
Subject: [Enigmail] Enigmail freeze when verify
In-Reply-To: <mailman.1441.1241608584.63231.enigmail@mozdev.org>
References: <gtrmmj$1chh$1@mozdev.mozdev.org>
	<mailman.1441.1241608584.63231.enigmail@mozdev.org>
Message-ID: <gtrua5$2l8o$1@mozdev.mozdev.org>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

Patrick Brunschwig a ?crit :

> Maybe you could try to verify a message directly on the command line to
> see the output from gpg? E.g. start gpg with the command line above and
> copy&paste the source of this message to the command line.

Hi Patrick,

And thank you for your answer, which indirectly point me the solution I
need.

The short answer: just rm -f ~/.gnupg/*.lock

The long answer: Trying to manually check your mail via gpg cli leads to
a denial of access of my keyring, so after some search I see these two
locks (~/.gnupg/pubring.gpg.lock and ~/.gnupg/secring.gpg.lock) with a
pid in them dead for 9 days if I believe the timestamps. I just remove
these lock files so gpg can access my pubkeyring and enigmail is now
again a pleasure to use :)

An other big "Thank you", Patrick!

Thomas.
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Version: GnuPG v1.4.9 (GNU/Linux)
Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org

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From rjh at sixdemonbag.org  Wed May  6 09:29:03 2009
From: rjh at sixdemonbag.org (Robert J. Hansen)
Date: Wed, 06 May 2009 12:29:03 -0400
Subject: [Enigmail] spoofability of inline-signed messages in enigmail
In-Reply-To: <4A0068C6.4010307@fifthhorseman.net>
References: <4A0068C6.4010307@fifthhorseman.net>
Message-ID: <4A01BACF.90102@sixdemonbag.org>

Daniel Kahn Gillmor wrote:
> But these injections seem dubious due to their spoofability.

On the one hand, I agree with you; on the other, I think history shows
this is not a pressing concern.  PGP Desktop did basically the same
thing for years, and I'm unaware of any successful spoofing attacks that
were applied against it.

That said, this is still something best addressed sooner rather than
later.  We should be wary of falling into the Russian Roulette Fallacy,
where just because something hasn't historically been a problem we
assume it will never be a problem.

(For those who've never heard of the RRF -- in American English,
"Russian roulette" is placing a single bullet into a revolver, spinning
the cylinder, putting it at your head and pulling the trigger.  If
you're lucky enough to survive pulling the trigger once, you shouldn't
take that as evidence that you can keep doing it.)



From georgi at forkbomb.nl  Thu May  7 08:13:21 2009
From: georgi at forkbomb.nl (Georgi Hristozov)
Date: Thu, 07 May 2009 18:13:21 +0300
Subject: [Enigmail] Enigmail hanging after unclean gpg shutdown
Message-ID: <4A02FA91.3060409@forkbomb.nl>

Hi,

I noted an issue with Enigmail and the way that it calls gpg. I had a
crash of my mail client. After I fired it up again and tried to access
my keyring, Enigmail hanged. I had to kill the gpg process in order to
wake up Thunderbird. The problem was that before the unclean shutdown of
Thunderbird, gpg has left some .lock files in my ~/.gnupg directory. And
every attempt to manually run gpg leads to the following:

gpg: waiting for lock (held by XXXX - probably dead) ...

And Enigmail waits for gpg to get responsive. And it can wait until the
user deletes the locks by hand. :) It would be nice if Enigmail stops
waiting in such situations and warns the user about the .lock files.
Don't you think so? :)

Best regards,
Georgi Hristozov

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From thomas at lecavelier.name  Thu May  7 10:21:42 2009
From: thomas at lecavelier.name (Thomas Lecavelier)
Date: Thu, 07 May 2009 19:21:42 +0200
Subject: [Enigmail] Enigmail hanging after unclean gpg shutdown
In-Reply-To: <mailman.1446.1241709213.63231.enigmail@mozdev.org>
References: <mailman.1446.1241709213.63231.enigmail@mozdev.org>
Message-ID: <4A0318A6.5000105@lecavelier.name>

Georgi Hristozov a ?crit :
> And Enigmail waits for gpg to get responsive. And it can wait until the
> user deletes the locks by hand. :) It would be nice if Enigmail stops
> waiting in such situations and warns the user about the .lock files.
> Don't you think so? :)
> 

My non-binding +1

It's exactly the problem I met last week (see my post from yesterday),
and a message from enigmail explaining why it was failing would help me
a lot.

Thomas.

From thomas at lecavelier.name  Thu May  7 10:21:42 2009
From: thomas at lecavelier.name (Thomas Lecavelier)
Date: Thu, 07 May 2009 19:21:42 +0200
Subject: [Enigmail] Enigmail hanging after unclean gpg shutdown
In-Reply-To: <mailman.1446.1241709213.63231.enigmail@mozdev.org>
References: <mailman.1446.1241709213.63231.enigmail@mozdev.org>
Message-ID: <4A0318A6.5000105@lecavelier.name>

Georgi Hristozov a ?crit :
> And Enigmail waits for gpg to get responsive. And it can wait until the
> user deletes the locks by hand. :) It would be nice if Enigmail stops
> waiting in such situations and warns the user about the .lock files.
> Don't you think so? :)
> 

My non-binding +1

It's exactly the problem I met last week (see my post from yesterday),
and a message from enigmail explaining why it was failing would help me
a lot.

Thomas.

From georgi at forkbomb.nl  Thu May  7 22:53:20 2009
From: georgi at forkbomb.nl (Georgi Hristozov)
Date: Fri, 08 May 2009 08:53:20 +0300
Subject: [Enigmail] Enigmail hanging after unclean gpg shutdown
In-Reply-To: <4A0318A6.5000105@lecavelier.name>
References: <mailman.1446.1241709213.63231.enigmail@mozdev.org>
	<4A0318A6.5000105@lecavelier.name>
Message-ID: <4A03C8D0.90906@forkbomb.nl>

Hi,

Thomas Lecavelier ??????:
> Georgi Hristozov a ?crit :
>> And Enigmail waits for gpg to get responsive. And it can wait until the
>> user deletes the locks by hand. :) It would be nice if Enigmail stops
>> waiting in such situations and warns the user about the .lock files.
>> Don't you think so? :)
>>
> 
> My non-binding +1
> 
> It's exactly the problem I met last week (see my post from yesterday),
> and a message from enigmail explaining why it was failing would help me
> a lot.
> 
> Thomas.
> _______________________________________________
> Enigmail mailing list
> Enigmail at mozdev.org
> https://www.mozdev.org/mailman/listinfo/enigmail

Sorry, I subscribed yesterday and just didn't read the archives before
posting.

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From patrick at mozilla-enigmail.org  Thu May  7 23:48:45 2009
From: patrick at mozilla-enigmail.org (Patrick Brunschwig)
Date: Fri, 08 May 2009 08:48:45 +0200
Subject: [Enigmail] Enigmail hanging after unclean gpg shutdown
In-Reply-To: <4A0318A6.5000105@lecavelier.name>
References: <mailman.1446.1241709213.63231.enigmail@mozdev.org>
	<4A0318A6.5000105@lecavelier.name>
Message-ID: <4A03D5CD.9080101@mozilla-enigmail.org>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA256

Thomas Lecavelier wrote:
> Georgi Hristozov a ?crit :
>> And Enigmail waits for gpg to get responsive. And it can wait until the
>> user deletes the locks by hand. :) It would be nice if Enigmail stops
>> waiting in such situations and warns the user about the .lock files.
>> Don't you think so? :)
>>
> 
> My non-binding +1
> 
> It's exactly the problem I met last week (see my post from yesterday),
> and a message from enigmail explaining why it was failing would help me
> a lot.

The problem is that GnuPG doesn't tell in a proper (i.e. parseable,
unique, non-localized) way that it's waiting for a lock. Checking for
something like "gpg: waiting for lock" doesn't succeed because the
message is different if GnuPG is used e.g. in German or French.

- -Patrick
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
Version: GnuPG v2.0.11 (GNU/Linux)
Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/

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From post at lespocky.de  Fri May  8 00:36:41 2009
From: post at lespocky.de (Alexander Dahl)
Date: Fri, 08 May 2009 09:36:41 +0200
Subject: [Enigmail] Enigmail hanging after unclean gpg shutdown
In-Reply-To: <4A03D5CD.9080101@mozilla-enigmail.org>
References: <mailman.1446.1241709213.63231.enigmail@mozdev.org>	<4A0318A6.5000105@lecavelier.name>
	<4A03D5CD.9080101@mozilla-enigmail.org>
Message-ID: <0MKuxg-1M2KdV31vl-0000if@mrelayeu.kundenserver.de>

Hi Patrick,

> The problem is that GnuPG doesn't tell in a proper (i.e. parseable,
> unique, non-localized) way that it's waiting for a lock. Checking for
> something like "gpg: waiting for lock" doesn't succeed because the
> message is different if GnuPG is used e.g. in German or French.

Can't you tell GnuPG in which language he should answer you? In shell
scripts I would set LANG=C and get the output regardless of user locale.

Greets
Alex

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From Jhony.Armando at djmtz.sld.cu  Fri May  8 03:35:10 2009
From: Jhony.Armando at djmtz.sld.cu (Jhony A Flores Balderrama(G11))
Date: Fri, 08 May 2009 03:35:10 -0700
Subject: [Enigmail] HELLO
In-Reply-To: <4A03D5CD.9080101@mozilla-enigmail.org>
References: <mailman.1446.1241709213.63231.enigmail@mozdev.org>
	<4A0318A6.5000105@lecavelier.name>
	<4A03D5CD.9080101@mozilla-enigmail.org>
Message-ID: <WorldClient-F200905080335.AA35100316@djmtz.sld.cu>

HOLA ..CHAVAL Q ES LO Q ME CUENTAS CO?O ....QUIERO UNA CUENTA DE CORREO EN 
ESTA PAGINA ..http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ NO SE SI PODRIAS DARME, POR QUE 
NECESITO COMUNICARME .......

 


-----Original Message-----
From: Patrick Brunschwig <patrick at mozilla-enigmail.org>
To: Enigmail user discussion list <enigmail at mozdev.org>
Date: Fri, 08 May 2009 08:48:45 +0200
Subject: Re: [Enigmail] Enigmail hanging after unclean gpg shutdown


-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA256

Thomas Lecavelier wrote:
> Georgi Hristozov a ?crit :
>> And Enigmail waits for gpg to get responsive. And it can wait until the
>> user deletes the locks by hand. :) It would be nice if Enigmail stops
>> waiting in such situations and warns the user about the .lock files.
>> Don't you think so? :)
>>
> 
> My non-binding +1
> 
> It's exactly the problem I met last week (see my post from yesterday),
> and a message from enigmail explaining why it was failing would help me
> a lot.

The problem is that GnuPG doesn't tell in a proper (i.e. parseable,
unique, non-localized) way that it's waiting for a lock. Checking for
something like "gpg: waiting for lock" doesn't succeed because the
message is different if GnuPG is used e.g. in German or French.

- -Patrick
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
Version: GnuPG v2.0.11 (GNU/Linux)
Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/

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_______________________________________________
Enigmail mailing list
Enigmail at mozdev.org
https://www.mozdev.org/mailman/listinfo/enigmail


La Facultad - Policlinico  26 de Julio Celebra el ??Aniversario 50 de la Revoluci?n Cubana ??

 



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From dkg at fifthhorseman.net  Fri May  8 07:44:19 2009
From: dkg at fifthhorseman.net (Daniel Kahn Gillmor)
Date: Fri, 08 May 2009 10:44:19 -0400
Subject: [Enigmail] Enigmail hanging after unclean gpg shutdown
In-Reply-To: <0MKuxg-1M2KdV31vl-0000if@mrelayeu.kundenserver.de>
References: <mailman.1446.1241709213.63231.enigmail@mozdev.org>	<4A0318A6.5000105@lecavelier.name>	<4A03D5CD.9080101@mozilla-enigmail.org>
	<0MKuxg-1M2KdV31vl-0000if@mrelayeu.kundenserver.de>
Message-ID: <4A044543.6040305@fifthhorseman.net>

On 05/08/2009 03:36 AM, Alexander Dahl wrote:
> Can't you tell GnuPG in which language he should answer you? In shell
> scripts I would set LANG=C and get the output regardless of user locale.

This is problematic if enigmail ever exposes the gnupg output to the
user, though.  in that case, it should use the user's locale.

Patrick, if you think gnupg should emit something parseable about
locking on (for example) the --status-fd, it'd be worth bringing it up
on gnupg-devel.  It's a reasonable development community.

	--dkg

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From patrick at mozilla-enigmail.org  Fri May  8 07:53:58 2009
From: patrick at mozilla-enigmail.org (Patrick Brunschwig)
Date: Fri, 08 May 2009 16:53:58 +0200
Subject: [Enigmail] Enigmail hanging after unclean gpg shutdown
In-Reply-To: <4A044543.6040305@fifthhorseman.net>
References: <mailman.1446.1241709213.63231.enigmail@mozdev.org>	<4A0318A6.5000105@lecavelier.name>	<4A03D5CD.9080101@mozilla-enigmail.org>	<0MKuxg-1M2KdV31vl-0000if@mrelayeu.kundenserver.de>
	<4A044543.6040305@fifthhorseman.net>
Message-ID: <4A044786.6030805@mozilla-enigmail.org>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA256

Daniel Kahn Gillmor wrote:
> On 05/08/2009 03:36 AM, Alexander Dahl wrote:
>> Can't you tell GnuPG in which language he should answer you? In shell
>> scripts I would set LANG=C and get the output regardless of user locale.
> 
> This is problematic if enigmail ever exposes the gnupg output to the
> user, though.  in that case, it should use the user's locale.
> 
> Patrick, if you think gnupg should emit something parseable about
> locking on (for example) the --status-fd, it'd be worth bringing it up
> on gnupg-devel.  It's a reasonable development community.

right :-)
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Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/

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=KsF9
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From georgi at forkbomb.nl  Fri May  8 10:02:18 2009
From: georgi at forkbomb.nl (Georgi Hristozov)
Date: Fri, 08 May 2009 20:02:18 +0300
Subject: [Enigmail] Enigmail hanging after unclean gpg shutdown
In-Reply-To: <4A03D5CD.9080101@mozilla-enigmail.org>
References: <mailman.1446.1241709213.63231.enigmail@mozdev.org>	<4A0318A6.5000105@lecavelier.name>
	<4A03D5CD.9080101@mozilla-enigmail.org>
Message-ID: <4A04659A.6080209@forkbomb.nl>

Hi,

Patrick Brunschwig ??????:
> <snip>
> 
> The problem is that GnuPG doesn't tell in a proper (i.e. parseable,
> unique, non-localized) way that it's waiting for a lock. Checking for
> something like "gpg: waiting for lock" doesn't succeed because the
> message is different if GnuPG is used e.g. in German or French.
> 
> -Patrick

Isn't it possible for Enigmail to give up after a reasonable amount of
time and tell the user that something's wrong with gpg?


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From faramir.cl at gmail.com  Fri May  8 13:06:56 2009
From: faramir.cl at gmail.com (Faramir)
Date: Fri, 08 May 2009 16:06:56 -0400
Subject: [Enigmail] HELLO
In-Reply-To: <WorldClient-F200905080335.AA35100316@djmtz.sld.cu>
References: <mailman.1446.1241709213.63231.enigmail@mozdev.org>	<4A0318A6.5000105@lecavelier.name>	<4A03D5CD.9080101@mozilla-enigmail.org>
	<WorldClient-F200905080335.AA35100316@djmtz.sld.cu>
Message-ID: <4A0490E0.4070908@gmail.com>

Jhony A Flores Balderrama(G11) escribi?:
> 
> HOLA ..CHAVAL Q ES LO Q ME CUENTAS CO?O ....QUIERO UNA CUENTA DE CORREO
> EN ESTA PAGINA .. http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ NO SE SI PODRIAS DARME,
> POR QUE NECESITO COMUNICARME .......


  Jhony, el sitio al que te refieres no es un proveedor de cuentas de
correo electr?nico, sino que es un sitio para el desarrollo y
distribuci?n del programa Enigmail, que es un agregado para instalar en
Mozilla Thunderbird, y as? poder utilizar GnuPG con Thunderbird. La idea
es que puedas usar GnuPG desde Thunderbird, pero en tu propia cuenta de
correo (por ejemplo, las de gmail funcionan de maravilla). En resumen,
el sitio provee herramientas para comunicarse, pero el e-mail lo debes
conseguir en otro sitio.


  He would like to have an e-mail address in the site
http://enigmail.mozdev.org, because he "needs to be able to communicate".

  I told him the site is to develop and release Enigmail, which is an
addon for TB, enabling it to work with GnuPG, and that he needs to use
his own e-mail address, and that gmail works fine for that purposes.

  Best Regards

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From jmoore3rd at bellsouth.net  Fri May  8 13:09:43 2009
From: jmoore3rd at bellsouth.net (John W. Moore III)
Date: Fri, 08 May 2009 16:09:43 -0400
Subject: [Enigmail] HELLO
In-Reply-To: <4A0490E0.4070908@gmail.com>
References: <mailman.1446.1241709213.63231.enigmail@mozdev.org>	<4A0318A6.5000105@lecavelier.name>	<4A03D5CD.9080101@mozilla-enigmail.org>	<WorldClient-F200905080335.AA35100316@djmtz.sld.cu>
	<4A0490E0.4070908@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4A049187.6000106@bellsouth.net>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA512

Faramir wrote:

>   He would like to have an e-mail address in the site
> http://enigmail.mozdev.org, because he "needs to be able to communicate".
> 
>   I told him the site is to develop and release Enigmail, which is an
> addon for TB, enabling it to work with GnuPG, and that he needs to use
> his own e-mail address, and that gmail works fine for that purposes.

<WHEW>  Thanks again for the translation work.  :-D

JOHN ;)
Timestamp: Friday 08 May 2009, 16:09  --400 (Eastern Daylight Time)
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Comment: Homepage:  http://tinyurl.com/yzhbhx

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From rjh at sixdemonbag.org  Fri May  8 13:11:08 2009
From: rjh at sixdemonbag.org (Robert J. Hansen)
Date: Fri, 08 May 2009 16:11:08 -0400
Subject: [Enigmail] HELLO
In-Reply-To: <4A0490E0.4070908@gmail.com>
References: <mailman.1446.1241709213.63231.enigmail@mozdev.org>	<4A0318A6.5000105@lecavelier.name>	<4A03D5CD.9080101@mozilla-enigmail.org>	<WorldClient-F200905080335.AA35100316@djmtz.sld.cu>
	<4A0490E0.4070908@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4A0491DC.2010807@sixdemonbag.org>

Faramir wrote:
>   I told him the site is to develop and release Enigmail, which is an
> addon for TB, enabling it to work with GnuPG, and that he needs to use
> his own e-mail address, and that gmail works fine for that purposes.

Thank you for the translation, Faramir!


From John at Mozilla-Enigmail.org  Fri May  8 13:36:49 2009
From: John at Mozilla-Enigmail.org (John Clizbe)
Date: Fri, 08 May 2009 15:36:49 -0500
Subject: [Enigmail] HELLO
In-Reply-To: <4A0490E0.4070908@gmail.com>
References: <mailman.1446.1241709213.63231.enigmail@mozdev.org>	<4A0318A6.5000105@lecavelier.name>	<4A03D5CD.9080101@mozilla-enigmail.org>	<WorldClient-F200905080335.AA35100316@djmtz.sld.cu>
	<4A0490E0.4070908@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4A0497E1.7030709@Mozilla-Enigmail.org>

Faramir wrote:
>   He would like to have an e-mail address in the site
> http://enigmail.mozdev.org, because he "needs to be able to communicate".
> 
>   I told him the site is to develop and release Enigmail, which is an
> addon for TB, enabling it to work with GnuPG, and that he needs to use
> his own e-mail address, and that gmail works fine for that purposes.

?Gracias por el trabajo de traducci?n!

Would you pass on that hijacking a thread is very poor netiquette. It is
much better to begin with a clean email and start a new thread than to
reply to an existing message and change the subject.

-- 
John P. Clizbe                      Inet:John (a) Mozilla-Enigmail.org
You can't spell fiasco without SCO. hkp://keyserver.gingerbear.net  or
     mailto:pgp-public-keys at gingerbear.net?subject=HELP

Q:"Just how do the residents of Haiku, Hawai'i hold conversations?"
A:"An odd melody / island voices on the winds / surplus of vowels"

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From faramir.cl at gmail.com  Fri May  8 14:23:23 2009
From: faramir.cl at gmail.com (Faramir)
Date: Fri, 08 May 2009 17:23:23 -0400
Subject: [Enigmail] About (Re:  HELLO)
Message-ID: <4A04A2CB.9060301@gmail.com>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA256

John Clizbe escribi?:
> Faramir wrote:
...
>>   I told him the site is to develop and release Enigmail, which is an
>> addon for TB, enabling it to work with GnuPG, and that he needs to use
>> his own e-mail address, and that gmail works fine for that purposes.
>
> ?Gracias por el trabajo de traducci?n!

  You are welcome ;)

> Would you pass on that hijacking a thread is very poor netiquette. It is
> much better to begin with a clean email and start a new thread than to
> reply to an existing message and change the subject.

  Sorry, I didn't think about that at that time, I'll be more careful in
future.

  Best Regards
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
Version: GnuPG v1.4.9 (MingW32)
Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org

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=VEfb
-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

From rjh at sixdemonbag.org  Fri May  8 15:16:26 2009
From: rjh at sixdemonbag.org (Robert J. Hansen)
Date: Fri, 08 May 2009 18:16:26 -0400
Subject: [Enigmail] About (Re:  HELLO)
In-Reply-To: <4A04A2CB.9060301@gmail.com>
References: <4A04A2CB.9060301@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4A04AF3A.5010201@sixdemonbag.org>

Faramir wrote:
>   Sorry, I didn't think about that at that time, I'll be more careful in
> future.

We're certainly not angry about it, Faramir.  :)  Besides, hindsight is
always 20/20.


From l.dobrev at gmail.com  Sat May  9 12:19:00 2009
From: l.dobrev at gmail.com (Lachezar Dobrev)
Date: Sat, 9 May 2009 22:19:00 +0300
Subject: [Enigmail] Enigmail on Ubuntu 9.04
In-Reply-To: <90266c3f0905050812r75a1d6du260dc9376d1bffbc@mail.gmail.com>
References: <4A004877.5060609@sixdemonbag.org>
	<90266c3f0905050812r75a1d6du260dc9376d1bffbc@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <90266c3f0905091219p1be8085aq887b617bfd0c0d24@mail.gmail.com>

  Could somebody tell me if this message got through?
  I didn't see a confirmation message, and also I don't see it on list archives.

2009/5/5 Lachezar Dobrev <l.dobrev at gmail.com>:
> ?I found out, that integrating with Ubuntu is the better option.
> ?1. In the User Settings open the Encryption/Keyring options (sorry, using non-English interface)
> ?2. Choose there to remember the password for let's say 5 minutes, rather than the default.
> ?3. Un-check the 'Ask before using remembered...'
> ?4. In Thunderbird open Enigmail's settings.
> ?5. Turn on the 'Do not ask for any passphrase'.
> ?6. Turn on the 'Display expert settings'
> ?7. Select OK.
> ?8. Open Engimail settings again.
> ?9. Go to Advanced tab.
> ?10. Turn on 'Use gpg-agent for passphrases'.
>
> ?A defect occurs, if you have visual effects turned on: when the
> password question pop-up occurs it is often displayed behind the
> Enigmail window, but has focus.
>
> 2009/5/5 Robert J. Hansen <rjh at sixdemonbag.org>:
>> Since upgrading to Ubuntu 9.04, I've discovered a weird behavior:
>> despite having my passphrase cache set to a nice high value, Enigmail
>> refuses to cache my passphrase for any length of time. ?Each and every
>> encrypted email I receive requires me to re-enter a passphrase all over
>> again.
>>
>> This occurs using official Ubuntu packages.
>>
>> Anyone know what's going on?
>> _______________________________________________
>> Enigmail mailing list
>> Enigmail at mozdev.org
>> https://www.mozdev.org/mailman/listinfo/enigmail
>>
>

From olav at mozilla-enigmail.org  Sat May  9 12:55:29 2009
From: olav at mozilla-enigmail.org (Olav Seyfarth)
Date: Sat, 09 May 2009 21:55:29 +0200
Subject: [Enigmail] Enigmail on Ubuntu 9.04]
Message-ID: <4A05DFB1.8080106@mozilla-enigmail.org>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA256

Hi Lachezar,

> Could somebody tell me if this message got through?
> I didn't see a confirmation message, and also I don't see it on list archives.

Yes, I received your message (attached).

Olav
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
Version: GnuPG v1.4.9 (MingW32)
Comment: Diese ist eine Digitale Signatur nach OpenPGP-Standard
Comment: http://privat.seyfarth.de/olav/schluessel.html

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From: Lachezar Dobrev <l.dobrev at gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Enigmail] Enigmail on Ubuntu 9.04
Date: Tue, 5 May 2009 18:12:21 +0300
Size: 6073
URL: <http://www.mozdev.org/pipermail/enigmail/attachments/20090509/d9e50b12/attachment.eml>

From patrick at mozilla-enigmail.org  Mon May 11 00:12:50 2009
From: patrick at mozilla-enigmail.org (Patrick Brunschwig)
Date: Mon, 11 May 2009 09:12:50 +0200
Subject: [Enigmail] Enigmail hanging after unclean gpg shutdown
In-Reply-To: <4A04659A.6080209@forkbomb.nl>
References: <mailman.1446.1241709213.63231.enigmail@mozdev.org>	<4A0318A6.5000105@lecavelier.name>	<4A03D5CD.9080101@mozilla-enigmail.org>
	<4A04659A.6080209@forkbomb.nl>
Message-ID: <4A07CFF2.9020207@mozilla-enigmail.org>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA256

Georgi Hristozov wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> Patrick Brunschwig ??????:
>> <snip>
>>
>> The problem is that GnuPG doesn't tell in a proper (i.e. parseable,
>> unique, non-localized) way that it's waiting for a lock. Checking for
>> something like "gpg: waiting for lock" doesn't succeed because the
>> message is different if GnuPG is used e.g. in German or French.
>>
>> -Patrick
> 
> Isn't it possible for Enigmail to give up after a reasonable amount of
> time and tell the user that something's wrong with gpg?

Not without rewriting half of the backend. But I just learned that the
authors of GnuPG have enhanced the algorithm for detecting dead lock
files; the problem will thus go away automatically.

- -Patrick
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
Version: GnuPG v2.0.11 (GNU/Linux)
Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/

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From patrick at mozilla-enigmail.org  Tue May 12 08:18:23 2009
From: patrick at mozilla-enigmail.org (Patrick Brunschwig)
Date: Tue, 12 May 2009 17:18:23 +0200
Subject: [Enigmail] About Supprting BCCed Recipients
Message-ID: <4A09933F.3080807@mozilla-enigmail.org>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA256

Up to now, Enigmail gave a warning if encrypted emails are sent to BCCed
recipients because GnuPG would store the key ID's of all recipients in
the encrypted message. In order to overcome this privacy issue, there is
an option that allows to tell GnuPG not to write some of the key ID's
into an encrypted message ("--no-throw-keyids" and
"--hidden-recipient"). If such "anonymous" key ID's are found in a
message, GnuPG would probe all secret keys until one of them allows to
decrypt the message.

Unfortunately, hiding the keys in a message is an optional part of the
OpenPGP standard; PGP (in particular) is known not to support it.

And here comes my question: please help us out by lettings us know how
many of your correspondents use a tool like PGP such that they would not
be able to decrypt messages with hidden keys by participating in the
poll on our forum:
<http://mozilla-enigmail.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=599>

Thanks,
Patrick
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
Version: GnuPG v2.0.11 (GNU/Linux)
Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/

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=UGuP
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From hrickards at l33tmyst.com  Tue May 12 08:50:54 2009
From: hrickards at l33tmyst.com (Harry Rickards)
Date: Tue, 12 May 2009 16:50:54 +0100
Subject: [Enigmail] About Supprting BCCed Recipients
In-Reply-To: <4A09933F.3080807@mozilla-enigmail.org>
References: <4A09933F.3080807@mozilla-enigmail.org>
Message-ID: <4A099ADE.4010407@l33tmyst.com>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

On 05/12/09 16:18, Patrick Brunschwig wrote:
> Up to now, Enigmail gave a warning if encrypted emails are sent to BCCed
> recipients because GnuPG would store the key ID's of all recipients in
> the encrypted message. In order to overcome this privacy issue, there is
> an option that allows to tell GnuPG not to write some of the key ID's
> into an encrypted message ("--no-throw-keyids" and
> "--hidden-recipient"). If such "anonymous" key ID's are found in a
> message, GnuPG would probe all secret keys until one of them allows to
> decrypt the message.
> 
> Unfortunately, hiding the keys in a message is an optional part of the
> OpenPGP standard; PGP (in particular) is known not to support it.
> 
> And here comes my question: please help us out by lettings us know how
> many of your correspondents use a tool like PGP such that they would not
> be able to decrypt messages with hidden keys by participating in the
> poll on our forum:
> <http://mozilla-enigmail.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=599>
> 
> Thanks,
> Patrick

Although I agree this is needed, perhaps a forum poll isn't the best way
for user's to vote (for need of a better word). I know I certainly think
it would be a lot easier just replying to this email than say: going to
the link above, logging in (or registering for some people) and voting.
This may be why there's only been one vote so far (as well as it's only
been half an hour since you started the thread).

Would it be possible for you to setup some sort of email based poll on
this mailing list, as I think a lot more people would vote then. For
now, if anyone wants to vote without having to register an account, etc,
I'll vote for them if they send me an email to hrickards at l33tmyst.com
encrypted with my GPG key - 1024D/646ED06A. That is, after the
administrator of the forum approves my account (see how long it will
take people to vote, most people will not bother.) Thanks


- -- 
Many thanks
Harry Rickards

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From patrick at mozilla-enigmail.org  Tue May 12 09:19:50 2009
From: patrick at mozilla-enigmail.org (Patrick Brunschwig)
Date: Tue, 12 May 2009 18:19:50 +0200
Subject: [Enigmail] About Supprting BCCed Recipients
In-Reply-To: <4A099ADE.4010407@l33tmyst.com>
References: <4A09933F.3080807@mozilla-enigmail.org>
	<4A099ADE.4010407@l33tmyst.com>
Message-ID: <4A09A1A6.8020007@mozilla-enigmail.org>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA256

Harry Rickards wrote:
> On 05/12/09 16:18, Patrick Brunschwig wrote:
>> Up to now, Enigmail gave a warning if encrypted emails are sent to BCCed
>> recipients because GnuPG would store the key ID's of all recipients in
>> the encrypted message. In order to overcome this privacy issue, there is
>> an option that allows to tell GnuPG not to write some of the key ID's
>> into an encrypted message ("--no-throw-keyids" and
>> "--hidden-recipient"). If such "anonymous" key ID's are found in a
>> message, GnuPG would probe all secret keys until one of them allows to
>> decrypt the message.
> 
>> Unfortunately, hiding the keys in a message is an optional part of the
>> OpenPGP standard; PGP (in particular) is known not to support it.
> 
>> And here comes my question: please help us out by lettings us know how
>> many of your correspondents use a tool like PGP such that they would not
>> be able to decrypt messages with hidden keys by participating in the
>> poll on our forum:
>> <http://mozilla-enigmail.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=599>
> 
>> Thanks,
>> Patrick
> 
> Although I agree this is needed, perhaps a forum poll isn't the best way
> for user's to vote (for need of a better word). I know I certainly think
> it would be a lot easier just replying to this email than say: going to
> the link above, logging in (or registering for some people) and voting.
> This may be why there's only been one vote so far (as well as it's only
> been half an hour since you started the thread).
> 
> Would it be possible for you to setup some sort of email based poll on
> this mailing list, as I think a lot more people would vote then. For
> now, if anyone wants to vote without having to register an account, etc,
> I'll vote for them if they send me an email to hrickards at l33tmyst.com
> encrypted with my GPG key - 1024D/646ED06A. That is, after the
> administrator of the forum approves my account (see how long it will
> take people to vote, most people will not bother.) Thanks

I forgot that the forum needs registration. Those who don't want to
register can send an email to the following address:
poll at mozilla-enigmail.org

Please indicate your answer to the following question:

How many of your correspondents use a product (like PGP) that doesn't
support hidden keys?

[ ] More than 50%
[ ] Between 20% and 50%
[ ] Less than 20%
[ ] None (i.e. 0%)
[ ] I don't know what software my correspondents use for encrypting messages

Thanks again
- -Patrick
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From dkg at fifthhorseman.net  Tue May 12 09:58:44 2009
From: dkg at fifthhorseman.net (Daniel Kahn Gillmor)
Date: Tue, 12 May 2009 12:58:44 -0400
Subject: [Enigmail] About Supprting BCCed Recipients
In-Reply-To: <4A09A1A6.8020007@mozilla-enigmail.org>
References: <4A09933F.3080807@mozilla-enigmail.org>	<4A099ADE.4010407@l33tmyst.com>
	<4A09A1A6.8020007@mozilla-enigmail.org>
Message-ID: <4A09AAC4.7070708@fifthhorseman.net>

On 05/12/2009 12:19 PM, Patrick Brunschwig wrote:
> I forgot that the forum needs registration. Those who don't want to
> register can send an email to the following address:
> poll at mozilla-enigmail.org
> 
> Please indicate your answer to the following question:
> 
> How many of your correspondents use a product (like PGP) that doesn't
> support hidden keys?
> 
> [ ] More than 50%
> [ ] Between 20% and 50%
> [ ] Less than 20%
> [ ] None (i.e. 0%)
> [ ] I don't know what software my correspondents use for encrypting messages

I believe that everyone who participates on public mailing lists like
this one *must* answer in the latter category, simply because we have no
idea who else is subscribed to the lists we use.  Of course, mails sent
to lists are not usually encrypted so perhaps this doesn't matter.

Perhaps it should be rephrased as "how many people do you send encrypted
mail to that cannot read it with hidden keys?"   Even so, it seems like
we might be asking the wrong people.

Also, please don't enable hidden recipients by setting --no-throw-ids,
which paints with far too wide a brush.  Better to use
--hidden-recipient for the specifically Bcc'ed folks.

Most simply, i could see this as the default behavior
(--hidden-recipient for Bcc), with the ability to set a per-recipient
rule disabling the feature.

	--dkg

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From jmoore3rd at bellsouth.net  Tue May 12 10:44:47 2009
From: jmoore3rd at bellsouth.net (John W. Moore III)
Date: Tue, 12 May 2009 13:44:47 -0400
Subject: [Enigmail] About Supprting BCCed Recipients
In-Reply-To: <4A09933F.3080807@mozilla-enigmail.org>
References: <4A09933F.3080807@mozilla-enigmail.org>
Message-ID: <4A09B58F.8050203@bellsouth.net>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA512

Patrick Brunschwig wrote:

> And here comes my question: please help us out by lettings us know how
> many of your correspondents use a tool like PGP such that they would not
> be able to decrypt messages with hidden keys by participating in the
> poll on our forum:
> <http://mozilla-enigmail.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=599>

As of now I know of 3 + Me.  ;)

JOHN 8-)
Timestamp: Tuesday 12 May 2009, 13:44  --400 (Eastern Daylight Time)
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Comment: Public Key at:  http://tinyurl.com/8cpho
Comment: Gossamer Spider Web of Trust: https://www.gswot.org
Comment: Homepage:  http://tinyurl.com/yzhbhx

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From olav at mozilla-enigmail.org  Wed May 13 07:06:28 2009
From: olav at mozilla-enigmail.org (Olav Seyfarth)
Date: Wed, 13 May 2009 16:06:28 +0200
Subject: [Enigmail] Ubuntu Seamonkey Enigmail
In-Reply-To: <49DB88F3.1040200@rainydayz.org>
References: <49D925FF.3070209@rainydayz.org>	<49DB77F7.5070300@fifthhorseman.net>
	<49DB88F3.1040200@rainydayz.org>
Message-ID: <4A0AD3E4.3010101@mozilla-enigmail.org>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA256

Hi Andy,

>>> New builds for the upcoming 9.04 Jaunty release of Ubuntu
>>> http://www.mozilla-enigmail.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=588
>> How do these differ from the packages distributed by ubuntu itself?
>> http://packages.ubuntu.com/enigmail
> The Ubuntu packages only support Thunderbird - these builds are for
> Seamonkey.

According to http://packages.ubuntu.com/jaunty/enigmail the distro
package should work for both Thunderbird and Seamonkey. Does it not?

Olav
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Version: GnuPG v1.4.9 (MingW32)
Comment: Diese ist eine Digitale Signatur nach OpenPGP-Standard
Comment: http://privat.seyfarth.de/olav/schluessel.html

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From andy.ruddock at rainydayz.org  Wed May 13 08:56:17 2009
From: andy.ruddock at rainydayz.org (Andy Ruddock)
Date: Wed, 13 May 2009 17:56:17 +0200
Subject: [Enigmail] Ubuntu Seamonkey Enigmail
In-Reply-To: <4A0AD3E4.3010101@mozilla-enigmail.org>
References: <49D925FF.3070209@rainydayz.org>	<49DB77F7.5070300@fifthhorseman.net>	<49DB88F3.1040200@rainydayz.org>
	<4A0AD3E4.3010101@mozilla-enigmail.org>
Message-ID: <4A0AEDA1.5080206@rainydayz.org>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

Olav Seyfarth wrote:
> Hi Andy,
> 
>>>> New builds for the upcoming 9.04 Jaunty release of Ubuntu
>>>> http://www.mozilla-enigmail.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=588
>>> How do these differ from the packages distributed by ubuntu itself?
>>> http://packages.ubuntu.com/enigmail
>> The Ubuntu packages only support Thunderbird - these builds are for
>> Seamonkey.
> 
> According to http://packages.ubuntu.com/jaunty/enigmail the distro
> package should work for both Thunderbird and Seamonkey. Does it not?
> 
> Olav

That page does sort of imply that the package will work with seamonkey -
but it doesn't.

dpkg -l enigmail -> Enigmail - GPG suppport for Thunderbird

Also, although the package page indicates that enigmail requires either
thunderbird or seamonkey-mailnews, at the top of the page it says
"OpenPGP extension for Thunderbird"

I've just tried it to be certain. On a machine that already had
Thunderbird & Enigmail installed I installed seamonkey. Enigmail support
conspicuous by its absence, so I re-installed enigmail - again, no
enigmail support in seamonkey.

- --
Andy Ruddock
- ------------
andy.ruddock at rainydayz.org (GPG Key ID 0xA622D452)
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
Version: GnuPG v1.4.9 (GNU/Linux)
Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org

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From olav at mozilla-enigmail.org  Wed May 13 09:18:21 2009
From: olav at mozilla-enigmail.org (Olav Seyfarth)
Date: Wed, 13 May 2009 18:18:21 +0200
Subject: [Enigmail] Ubuntu Seamonkey Enigmail
In-Reply-To: <4A0AEDA1.5080206@rainydayz.org>
References: <49D925FF.3070209@rainydayz.org>	<49DB77F7.5070300@fifthhorseman.net>	<49DB88F3.1040200@rainydayz.org>	<4A0AD3E4.3010101@mozilla-enigmail.org>
	<4A0AEDA1.5080206@rainydayz.org>
Message-ID: <4A0AF2CD.6000802@mozilla-enigmail.org>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA256

Hi Andy,

thanks a lot for testing. Could you please tell the maintainer team
(via launchpad) about your findings (e.g. by posting your last enigmail
list message there)?

Olav
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
Version: GnuPG v1.4.9 (MingW32)
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Comment: http://privat.seyfarth.de/olav/schluessel.html

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From andy.ruddock at rainydayz.org  Wed May 13 10:51:57 2009
From: andy.ruddock at rainydayz.org (Andy Ruddock)
Date: Wed, 13 May 2009 19:51:57 +0200
Subject: [Enigmail] Ubuntu Seamonkey Enigmail
In-Reply-To: <4A0AF2CD.6000802@mozilla-enigmail.org>
References: <49D925FF.3070209@rainydayz.org>	<49DB77F7.5070300@fifthhorseman.net>	<49DB88F3.1040200@rainydayz.org>	<4A0AD3E4.3010101@mozilla-enigmail.org>	<4A0AEDA1.5080206@rainydayz.org>
	<4A0AF2CD.6000802@mozilla-enigmail.org>
Message-ID: <4A0B08BD.7010906@rainydayz.org>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

Olav Seyfarth wrote:
> Hi Andy,
> 
> thanks a lot for testing. Could you please tell the maintainer team
> (via launchpad) about your findings (e.g. by posting your last enigmail
> list message there)?
> 
> Olav

https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/enigmail/+bug/376132

- --
Andy Ruddock
- ------------
andy.ruddock at rainydayz.org (GPG Key ID 0xA622D452)
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From patrick at mozilla-enigmail.org  Wed May 13 12:31:32 2009
From: patrick at mozilla-enigmail.org (Patrick Brunschwig)
Date: Wed, 13 May 2009 21:31:32 +0200
Subject: [Enigmail] About Supprting BCCed Recipients
In-Reply-To: <4A09AAC4.7070708@fifthhorseman.net>
References: <4A09933F.3080807@mozilla-enigmail.org>	<4A099ADE.4010407@l33tmyst.com>	<4A09A1A6.8020007@mozilla-enigmail.org>
	<4A09AAC4.7070708@fifthhorseman.net>
Message-ID: <4A0B2014.3020906@mozilla-enigmail.org>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
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Daniel Kahn Gillmor wrote:
> On 05/12/2009 12:19 PM, Patrick Brunschwig wrote:
>> I forgot that the forum needs registration. Those who don't want to
>> register can send an email to the following address:
>> poll at mozilla-enigmail.org
>>
>> Please indicate your answer to the following question:
>>
>> How many of your correspondents use a product (like PGP) that doesn't
>> support hidden keys?
>>
>> [ ] More than 50%
>> [ ] Between 20% and 50%
>> [ ] Less than 20%
>> [ ] None (i.e. 0%)
>> [ ] I don't know what software my correspondents use for encrypting messages
> 
> I believe that everyone who participates on public mailing lists like
> this one *must* answer in the latter category, simply because we have no
> idea who else is subscribed to the lists we use.  Of course, mails sent
> to lists are not usually encrypted so perhaps this doesn't matter.

Right, in addition I wouldn't necessarily call mailing lists as
"correspondents"; you often don't write mails to someone specifically on
a mailing list.

> Perhaps it should be rephrased as "how many people do you send encrypted
> mail to that cannot read it with hidden keys?"   Even so, it seems like
> we might be asking the wrong people.

I'm very well aware of the fact that most (if not very close to all)
people subscribed to this mailing list are using GnuPG and/or are
otherwise interested in Enigmail or Open Source software. This certainly
leads to a biased result. However, other user groups might not even know
what software they use for encryption, not to talk of their correspondents.

> Also, please don't enable hidden recipients by setting --no-throw-ids,
> which paints with far too wide a brush.  Better to use
> --hidden-recipient for the specifically Bcc'ed folks.
> 
> Most simply, i could see this as the default behavior
> (--hidden-recipient for Bcc), with the ability to set a per-recipient
> rule disabling the feature.

As with most features, it's possible to design simple ways to support
them, like adding "--no-throw-keyids" (which would take me less than 1
hour to implement and test), and complex solutions that go as far as
extending the per-recipient rules (which would require at least several
days of work).

Given that I'm working on Enigmail during my very limited free time, you
might agree that I'm probably better off developing something really
useful, and not invest several days just to support the special case of
a few users who want to fully automate the sending of encrypted messages
to BCC'ed recipients who use software that doesn't fully support some
specific optional part of the OpenPGP standard ;-)

- -Patrick
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
Version: GnuPG v2.0.11 (GNU/Linux)
Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/

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=L1P6
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From dkg at fifthhorseman.net  Wed May 13 13:12:23 2009
From: dkg at fifthhorseman.net (Daniel Kahn Gillmor)
Date: Wed, 13 May 2009 16:12:23 -0400
Subject: [Enigmail] About Supprting BCCed Recipients
In-Reply-To: <4A0B2014.3020906@mozilla-enigmail.org>
References: <4A09933F.3080807@mozilla-enigmail.org>	<4A099ADE.4010407@l33tmyst.com>	<4A09A1A6.8020007@mozilla-enigmail.org>	<4A09AAC4.7070708@fifthhorseman.net>
	<4A0B2014.3020906@mozilla-enigmail.org>
Message-ID: <4A0B29A7.5080908@fifthhorseman.net>

On 05/13/2009 03:31 PM, Patrick Brunschwig wrote:
> As with most features, it's possible to design simple ways to support
> them, like adding "--no-throw-keyids" (which would take me less than 1
> hour to implement and test), and complex solutions that go as far as
> extending the per-recipient rules (which would require at least several
> days of work).

I appreciate that extending per-recipient rules is more work.  But
please don't just add --throw-keyids (note that the negation is a little
wacky on this option) in general, because it adds additional cost to
*every* recipient, not just the Bcc contacts.  Each client will need to
try to decrypt every session key in turn until they find the one that is
encrypted to their key.

For messages with N recipients, this increases the time to decrypt the
message by a factor of N/2.  As keysizes get larger, this cost scales up :(

> Given that I'm working on Enigmail during my very limited free time, you
> might agree that I'm probably better off developing something really
> useful, and not invest several days just to support the special case of
> a few users who want to fully automate the sending of encrypted messages
> to BCC'ed recipients who use software that doesn't fully support some
> specific optional part of the OpenPGP standard ;-)

If we're making those kind of tradeoffs (i think they're reasonable
tradeoffs to make), i'd say that adding --hidden-recipient for each
Bcc'ed recipient is the way to go, and leave per-recipient rules as a
later project if people complain.  This keeps the the UI cleaner anyway.

	--dkg

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From John at Mozilla-Enigmail.org  Wed May 13 13:48:30 2009
From: John at Mozilla-Enigmail.org (John Clizbe)
Date: Wed, 13 May 2009 15:48:30 -0500
Subject: [Enigmail] About Supprting BCCed Recipients
In-Reply-To: <4A0B29A7.5080908@fifthhorseman.net>
References: <4A09933F.3080807@mozilla-enigmail.org>	<4A099ADE.4010407@l33tmyst.com>	<4A09A1A6.8020007@mozilla-enigmail.org>	<4A09AAC4.7070708@fifthhorseman.net>	<4A0B2014.3020906@mozilla-enigmail.org>
	<4A0B29A7.5080908@fifthhorseman.net>
Message-ID: <4A0B321E.1040401@Mozilla-Enigmail.org>

Daniel Kahn Gillmor wrote:
> On 05/13/2009 03:31 PM, Patrick Brunschwig wrote:
> I appreciate that extending per-recipient rules is more work.  But
> please don't just add --throw-keyids (note that the negation is a little
> wacky on this option) in general, because it adds additional cost to
> *every* recipient, not just the Bcc contacts.  Each client will need to
> try to decrypt every session key in turn until they find the one that is
> encrypted to their key.
> 
> For messages with N recipients, this increases the time to decrypt the
> message by a factor of N/2.  As keysizes get larger, this cost scales up :(
> 
>> Given that I'm working on Enigmail during my very limited free time, you
>> might agree that I'm probably better off developing something really
>> useful, and not invest several days just to support the special case of
>> a few users who want to fully automate the sending of encrypted messages
>> to BCC'ed recipients who use software that doesn't fully support some
>> specific optional part of the OpenPGP standard ;-)
> 
> If we're making those kind of tradeoffs (i think they're reasonable
> tradeoffs to make), i'd say that adding --hidden-recipient for each
> Bcc'ed recipient is the way to go, and leave per-recipient rules as a
> later project if people complain.  This keeps the the UI cleaner anyway.

--hidden-recipient _WAS_ the suggested method from the beginning.

https://www.mozdev.org/bugs/show_bug.cgi?id=20867
Summary:RFE: Pass BCC recip to gpg with --hidden-recipient instead of -r

-- 
John P. Clizbe                      Inet:John (a) Mozilla-Enigmail.org
You can't spell fiasco without SCO. hkp://keyserver.gingerbear.net  or
     mailto:pgp-public-keys at gingerbear.net?subject=HELP

Q:"Just how do the residents of Haiku, Hawai'i hold conversations?"
A:"An odd melody / island voices on the winds / surplus of vowels"

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From patrick at mozilla-enigmail.org  Wed May 13 13:57:03 2009
From: patrick at mozilla-enigmail.org (Patrick Brunschwig)
Date: Wed, 13 May 2009 22:57:03 +0200
Subject: [Enigmail] About Supprting BCCed Recipients
In-Reply-To: <4A0B29A7.5080908@fifthhorseman.net>
References: <4A09933F.3080807@mozilla-enigmail.org>	<4A099ADE.4010407@l33tmyst.com>	<4A09A1A6.8020007@mozilla-enigmail.org>	<4A09AAC4.7070708@fifthhorseman.net>	<4A0B2014.3020906@mozilla-enigmail.org>
	<4A0B29A7.5080908@fifthhorseman.net>
Message-ID: <4A0B341F.8050404@mozilla-enigmail.org>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA256

Daniel Kahn Gillmor wrote:
> On 05/13/2009 03:31 PM, Patrick Brunschwig wrote:
>> As with most features, it's possible to design simple ways to support
>> them, like adding "--no-throw-keyids" (which would take me less than 1
>> hour to implement and test), and complex solutions that go as far as
>> extending the per-recipient rules (which would require at least several
>> days of work).
> 
> I appreciate that extending per-recipient rules is more work.  But
> please don't just add --throw-keyids (note that the negation is a little
> wacky on this option) in general, because it adds additional cost to
> *every* recipient, not just the Bcc contacts.  Each client will need to
> try to decrypt every session key in turn until they find the one that is
> encrypted to their key.

Of course I'm aware of the implications. But unfortunately, it seems
that GnuPG also tries to alwys probe the anonymous key ID's -- even if
some known key ID with existing secret key is available. But that's a
different story. In any case, I would not introduce a potential
compatibility issue with other systems without informing or asking the user.

> For messages with N recipients, this increases the time to decrypt the
> message by a factor of N/2.  As keysizes get larger, this cost scales up :(
> 
>> Given that I'm working on Enigmail during my very limited free time, you
>> might agree that I'm probably better off developing something really
>> useful, and not invest several days just to support the special case of
>> a few users who want to fully automate the sending of encrypted messages
>> to BCC'ed recipients who use software that doesn't fully support some
>> specific optional part of the OpenPGP standard ;-)
> 
> If we're making those kind of tradeoffs (i think they're reasonable
> tradeoffs to make), i'd say that adding --hidden-recipient for each
> Bcc'ed recipient is the way to go, and leave per-recipient rules as a
> later project if people complain.  This keeps the the UI cleaner anyway.

Unfortunately this option is not always feasible (which is the main
reason for the poll). Imagine an email sent to R1 and R2, bcc: to B1 and
B2. For whatever reason R2 and B2 don't have a key corresponding to
their email address, nor any defined per-recipient rules. The key
selection dialog is opened and the user selects the two additional keys.
But ... which of the selected keys belongs to B2 and should be hidden?
The dialog can't link the not found email addresses with the selected
keys. All it does is to create a list of key ID's, starting with some
given email addresses plus user input to (de-)select keys.

- -Patrick
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
Version: GnuPG v2.0.11 (GNU/Linux)
Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/

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From rjh at sixdemonbag.org  Wed May 13 14:01:34 2009
From: rjh at sixdemonbag.org (Robert J. Hansen)
Date: Wed, 13 May 2009 17:01:34 -0400
Subject: [Enigmail] About Supprting BCCed Recipients
In-Reply-To: <4A0B321E.1040401@Mozilla-Enigmail.org>
References: <4A09933F.3080807@mozilla-enigmail.org>	<4A099ADE.4010407@l33tmyst.com>	<4A09A1A6.8020007@mozilla-enigmail.org>	<4A09AAC4.7070708@fifthhorseman.net>	<4A0B2014.3020906@mozilla-enigmail.org>	<4A0B29A7.5080908@fifthhorseman.net>
	<4A0B321E.1040401@Mozilla-Enigmail.org>
Message-ID: <4A0B352E.6000801@sixdemonbag.org>

John Clizbe wrote:
> https://www.mozdev.org/bugs/show_bug.cgi?id=20867
> Summary:RFE: Pass BCC recip to gpg with --hidden-recipient instead of -r

Given this RFE has such a large potential impact on users and there is
no consensus for if it should be implemented, I think this RFE needs to
be tagged NOTNOW and work shifted to other things in the RFE queue.

I do not think this RFE is ripe for implementation.  Let's keep
discussing it, sure -- but let's not implement it now.  Six months from
now, maybe.


From John at Mozilla-Enigmail.org  Wed May 13 14:11:39 2009
From: John at Mozilla-Enigmail.org (John Clizbe)
Date: Wed, 13 May 2009 16:11:39 -0500
Subject: [Enigmail] About Supprting BCCed Recipients
In-Reply-To: <4A0B352E.6000801@sixdemonbag.org>
References: <4A09933F.3080807@mozilla-enigmail.org>	<4A099ADE.4010407@l33tmyst.com>	<4A09A1A6.8020007@mozilla-enigmail.org>	<4A09AAC4.7070708@fifthhorseman.net>	<4A0B2014.3020906@mozilla-enigmail.org>	<4A0B29A7.5080908@fifthhorseman.net>	<4A0B321E.1040401@Mozilla-Enigmail.org>
	<4A0B352E.6000801@sixdemonbag.org>
Message-ID: <4A0B378B.3050904@Mozilla-Enigmail.org>

Robert J. Hansen wrote:
> John Clizbe wrote:
>> https://www.mozdev.org/bugs/show_bug.cgi?id=20867
>> Summary:RFE: Pass BCC recip to gpg with --hidden-recipient instead of -r
> 
> Given this RFE has such a large potential impact on users and there is
> no consensus for if it should be implemented, I think this RFE needs to
> be tagged NOTNOW and work shifted to other things in the RFE queue.
> 
> I do not think this RFE is ripe for implementation.  Let's keep
> discussing it, sure -- but let's not implement it now.  Six months from
> now, maybe.

Given Patrick's clarification about the key selection dialog, I agree.
That's an awfully snarly issue that needs resolved first.

Let's take it back to the devel list and beat on it a bit more.

-- 
John P. Clizbe                      Inet:John (a) Mozilla-Enigmail.org
You can't spell fiasco without SCO. hkp://keyserver.gingerbear.net  or
     mailto:pgp-public-keys at gingerbear.net?subject=HELP

Q:"Just how do the residents of Haiku, Hawai'i hold conversations?"
A:"An odd melody / island voices on the winds / surplus of vowels"

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From ammdias at gmail.com  Wed May 13 14:08:49 2009
From: ammdias at gmail.com (Antonio Manuel Dias)
Date: Wed, 13 May 2009 22:08:49 +0100
Subject: [Enigmail] About Supprting BCCed Recipients
In-Reply-To: <4A0B341F.8050404@mozilla-enigmail.org>
References: <4A09933F.3080807@mozilla-enigmail.org>	<4A099ADE.4010407@l33tmyst.com>	<4A09A1A6.8020007@mozilla-enigmail.org>	<4A09AAC4.7070708@fifthhorseman.net>	<4A0B2014.3020906@mozilla-enigmail.org>	<4A0B29A7.5080908@fifthhorseman.net>
	<4A0B341F.8050404@mozilla-enigmail.org>
Message-ID: <4A0B36E1.8060801@gmail.com>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA512

Hello.

Patrick Brunschwig escreveu:
> Unfortunately this option is not always feasible (which is the main
> reason for the poll). Imagine an email sent to R1 and R2, bcc: to B1 and
> B2. For whatever reason R2 and B2 don't have a key corresponding to
> their email address, nor any defined per-recipient rules. The key
> selection dialog is opened and the user selects the two additional keys.
> But ... which of the selected keys belongs to B2 and should be hidden?
> The dialog can't link the not found email addresses with the selected
> keys. All it does is to create a list of key ID's, starting with some
> given email addresses plus user input to (de-)select keys.

I think this could be solved by presenting the key selection dialog two
times, one for the 'normal' recipients (TO and CC) and another for the
BCC recipients.  This way enigmail would know to which keys to add the
- --hidden-recipient switch.

- -- 	
Ant?nio Manuel Dias
http://maracuja.homeip.net
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Version: GnuPG v1.4.9 (GNU/Linux)
Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org

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From rjh at sixdemonbag.org  Wed May 13 17:48:44 2009
From: rjh at sixdemonbag.org (Robert J. Hansen)
Date: Wed, 13 May 2009 20:48:44 -0400
Subject: [Enigmail] About Supprting BCCed Recipients
In-Reply-To: <4A0B36E1.8060801@gmail.com>
References: <4A09933F.3080807@mozilla-enigmail.org>	<4A099ADE.4010407@l33tmyst.com>	<4A09A1A6.8020007@mozilla-enigmail.org>	<4A09AAC4.7070708@fifthhorseman.net>	<4A0B2014.3020906@mozilla-enigmail.org>	<4A0B29A7.5080908@fifthhorseman.net>	<4A0B341F.8050404@mozilla-enigmail.org>
	<4A0B36E1.8060801@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4A0B6A6C.8040405@sixdemonbag.org>

Antonio Manuel Dias wrote:
> I think this could be solved by presenting the key selection dialog two
> times, one for the 'normal' recipients (TO and CC) and another for the
> BCC recipients.  This way enigmail would know to which keys to add the
> --hidden-recipient switch.

Unacceptable.  We had this discussion on the -devel list a while ago,
when we took a look at in the worst case how many screens Enigmail will
pop up at you before you're actually able to send your email.  It was
either seven or nine, I don't remember which.

I don't want to see it become either eight or ten.


From patrick at mozilla-enigmail.org  Wed May 13 23:26:45 2009
From: patrick at mozilla-enigmail.org (Patrick Brunschwig)
Date: Thu, 14 May 2009 08:26:45 +0200
Subject: [Enigmail] About Supprting BCCed Recipients
In-Reply-To: <4A0B352E.6000801@sixdemonbag.org>
References: <4A09933F.3080807@mozilla-enigmail.org>	<4A099ADE.4010407@l33tmyst.com>	<4A09A1A6.8020007@mozilla-enigmail.org>	<4A09AAC4.7070708@fifthhorseman.net>	<4A0B2014.3020906@mozilla-enigmail.org>	<4A0B29A7.5080908@fifthhorseman.net>	<4A0B321E.1040401@Mozilla-Enigmail.org>
	<4A0B352E.6000801@sixdemonbag.org>
Message-ID: <4A0BB9A5.3020209@mozilla-enigmail.org>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA256

Robert J. Hansen wrote:
> John Clizbe wrote:
>> https://www.mozdev.org/bugs/show_bug.cgi?id=20867
>> Summary:RFE: Pass BCC recip to gpg with --hidden-recipient instead of -r
> 
> Given this RFE has such a large potential impact on users and there is
> no consensus for if it should be implemented, I think this RFE needs to
> be tagged NOTNOW and work shifted to other things in the RFE queue.
> 
> I do not think this RFE is ripe for implementation.  Let's keep
> discussing it, sure -- but let's not implement it now.  Six months from
> now, maybe.

I tend to disagree here: currently, Enigmail doesn't allow to send
emails to BCC'ed users at all. Thus, any solution that allows to send
encrypted emails to BCC'ed users is an improvement; at least as long as
the users are informed about the consequences and can decide how to
proceed. Even if we only reach a (simple) 80% solution in a 1st step,
it's still better than disallowing BCC-emails completely. Thus I think
it's still worth doing it.

- -Patrick
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Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/

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From Liste at FamilleCollet.com  Sat May 23 04:20:19 2009
From: Liste at FamilleCollet.com (Remi Collet)
Date: Sat, 23 May 2009 13:20:19 +0200
Subject: [Enigmail] Enigmail on Fedora / RHEL / CentOS
Message-ID: <4A17DBF3.6030205@FamilleCollet.com>

Hi,

Enigmail will be shortly available on RpmFusion repository.
http://rpmfusion.org/

Will provides :
enigmail 0.95.7 for Fedora 9, 10 and EL 5 (thunderbird 2.0.0.21)
enigmail 0.96a (20090521) for Fedora 11 (thunderbird 3.0b2)

I will stil provides it on remi repository for "backport" version of
thunderbird on older Fedora.

During all the tests done, I noticed

0.95.7 run well with TH 2.x and is disabled with TH 3.x : OK.

0.96a run well with TH 3.0b2 ou 3.0b3pre but is not disabled with TH 2.x
and it crash... (quite normal I think).

Should the minVersion be raised ?

Regards

From andreas.fenner at thalesgroup.com  Sat May 23 07:00:11 2009
From: andreas.fenner at thalesgroup.com (andreas.fenner at thalesgroup.com)
Date: Sat, 23 May 2009 16:00:11 +0200
Subject: [Enigmail] Andreas Fenner is out of the office.
Message-ID: <OF99DF610E.913D6370-ONC12575BF.004CEBE9-C12575BF.004CEBE9@thalesgroup.com>

An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://www.mozdev.org/pipermail/enigmail/attachments/20090523/96c3cbb7/attachment.html>

From patrick at mozilla-enigmail.org  Sat May 23 07:36:55 2009
From: patrick at mozilla-enigmail.org (Patrick Brunschwig)
Date: Sat, 23 May 2009 16:36:55 +0200
Subject: [Enigmail] Enigmail on Fedora / RHEL / CentOS
In-Reply-To: <4A17DBF3.6030205@FamilleCollet.com>
References: <4A17DBF3.6030205@FamilleCollet.com>
Message-ID: <4A180A07.4090600@mozilla-enigmail.org>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA256

Remi Collet wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> Enigmail will be shortly available on RpmFusion repository.
> http://rpmfusion.org/
> 
> Will provides :
> enigmail 0.95.7 for Fedora 9, 10 and EL 5 (thunderbird 2.0.0.21)
> enigmail 0.96a (20090521) for Fedora 11 (thunderbird 3.0b2)
> 
> I will stil provides it on remi repository for "backport" version of
> thunderbird on older Fedora.
> 
> During all the tests done, I noticed
> 
> 0.95.7 run well with TH 2.x and is disabled with TH 3.x : OK.
> 
> 0.96a run well with TH 3.0b2 ou 3.0b3pre but is not disabled with TH 2.x
> and it crash... (quite normal I think).
> 
> Should the minVersion be raised ?

Hi Remi

That's great news!

The minVersion does not need to be raised in general in the source code
since the Enigmail trunk can be compiled for TB2 and TB3. However, if
you have a binary for TB3, then it will crash on TB2 and vice versa.
Thus, if you have a compiled (binary) version of Enigmail, you might
want to adjust the minVersion and maxVersion (and the supported
applications and supported platforms) according to your needs.

- -Patrick
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Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/

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From matt.hickford at gmail.com  Thu May 21 08:36:59 2009
From: matt.hickford at gmail.com (Matt Hickford)
Date: Thu, 21 May 2009 16:36:59 +0100
Subject: [Enigmail] Enigmail for Thunderbird 3 on 64 bit Linux
Message-ID: <4A15751B.7090407@gmail.com>

Hi

Has anyone built an Enigmail nightly (compatible with Thunderbird 3) for 
64 bit Linux?

At present on the downloads page, builds for 64 bit Linux and 
Thunderbird 3 are mutually exclusive. I wish to use Enigmail on Fedora 
11, which ships with Thunderbird 3 beta. If no-one has a build, I shall 
myself attempt to compile, if successful I shall post the build here.

Matt

From b.sullivan83 at gmail.com  Mon May 25 09:17:17 2009
From: b.sullivan83 at gmail.com (Brendan Sullivan)
Date: Mon, 25 May 2009 12:17:17 -0400
Subject: [Enigmail] Enigmail 'latched' onto invalide gpg key
Message-ID: <4A1AC48D.9030307@gmail.com>

Hello all, I've recently tried to register a gpg key (first one ever)
and at the same time installed enigmail for Thunderbird. I didn't
realize enigmail would handle that for me, so at the cmd line I ran:

gpg --gen-key

and ran through the options and set it up and then :

gpg --server keyserver.ubuntu.com --send-keys

waited for my confirmation email, and in the mean time, setup enigmail
(via the initial wizard) with my new gpg key and associated it with my
primary email account.

When the confirmation email came I got a surprise. I must have mistyped
my ~25 character passphrase twice as I could not unlock the encrypted
confirmation email from the keyserver. At this point I didn't know about
revocation certificates so I just deleted the key and started over.
Registered the new key, updated my new key in enigmail and it
/decrypted/ my confirmation email just fine. However when i went to
compose an email and send it, I got the following error :

gpg command line and output:
/usr/bin/gpg --charset utf8 --batch --no-tty --status-fd 2 -t
--clearsign -u 0xD9084941 --use-agent
gpg: skipped "0xD9084941":secret key not available
gpg: [stdin]: clearsign failed: secret key not available

Now, the problem is that D9084941 is that 'first key' that I do not have
the secret (or public) files for anymore....and no matter what I do I
can't get enigmail to use my new current key FOR SENDING email that is
setup and registered and works for decrypting mail in Thunderbird.

Does anyone have any ideas? Sorry for being so wordy, I'm really
confused as to what is not getting configured correctly. If you need any
more info please let me know.

Thanks
-Brendan

From hrickards at l33tmyst.com  Mon May 25 09:44:23 2009
From: hrickards at l33tmyst.com (Harry Rickards)
Date: Mon, 25 May 2009 17:44:23 +0100
Subject: [Enigmail] Test encrypted email
Message-ID: <4A1ACAE7.7060306@l33tmyst.com>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

Please could someone send me a test encrypted email encrypted to GPG Key
ID 646ED06A, so I can test whether I've got everything setup correctly.
If needed, my public key's at
http://pgp.mit.edu:11371/pks/lookup?op=get&search=0x646ED06A.

Thanks


- -- 
Many thanks
Harry Rickards (GPG Key ID:646ED06A)

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From hrickards at l33tmyst.com  Mon May 25 09:54:55 2009
From: hrickards at l33tmyst.com (Harry Rickards)
Date: Mon, 25 May 2009 17:54:55 +0100
Subject: [Enigmail] Test encrypted email
In-Reply-To: <4A1ACC70.5050104@rainydayz.org>
References: <4A1ACAE7.7060306@l33tmyst.com> <4A1ACC70.5050104@rainydayz.org>
Message-ID: <4A1ACD5F.4040609@l33tmyst.com>

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To the rest of the list, I was just saying okay.

From Liste at FamilleCollet.com  Mon May 25 10:15:10 2009
From: Liste at FamilleCollet.com (Remi Collet)
Date: Mon, 25 May 2009 19:15:10 +0200
Subject: [Enigmail] Enigmail for Thunderbird 3 on 64 bit Linux
In-Reply-To: <4A15751B.7090407@gmail.com>
References: <4A15751B.7090407@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4A1AD21E.5060104@FamilleCollet.com>

Le 21/05/2009 17:36, Matt Hickford a ?crit :
> Hi
> 
> Has anyone built an Enigmail nightly (compatible with Thunderbird 3) for
> 64 bit Linux?
> 
> At present on the downloads page, builds for 64 bit Linux and
> Thunderbird 3 are mutually exclusive. I wish to use Enigmail on Fedora
> 11, which ships with Thunderbird 3 beta. If no-one has a build, I shall
> myself attempt to compile, if successful I shall post the build here.

thunderbird-enigmail is available on RpmFusion[1][2]

So : yum install thunderbird-enigmail

+

[1] http://rpmfusion.org/
[2]
http://download1.rpmfusion.org/free/fedora/development/x86_64/os/repoview/thunderbird-enigmail.html

> 
> Matt
> _______________________________________________
> Enigmail mailing list
> Enigmail at mozdev.org
> https://www.mozdev.org/mailman/listinfo/enigmail
> 


From John at Mozilla-Enigmail.org  Mon May 25 10:16:00 2009
From: John at Mozilla-Enigmail.org (John Clizbe)
Date: Mon, 25 May 2009 12:16:00 -0500
Subject: [Enigmail] Test encrypted email
In-Reply-To: <4A1ACAE7.7060306@l33tmyst.com>
References: <4A1ACAE7.7060306@l33tmyst.com>
Message-ID: <4A1AD250.9090100@Mozilla-Enigmail.org>

Harry Rickards wrote:
> Please could someone send me a test encrypted email encrypted to GPG Key
> ID 646ED06A, so I can test whether I've got everything setup correctly.

Believe it or not, the simplest test is to send yourself encrypted
email. I've use that technique many times when testing things.

> If needed, my public key's at
> http://pgp.mit.edu:11371/pks/lookup?op=get&search=0x646ED06A.

Please Please Please Do NOT use that server. The code is unmaintained
and for many new features of RFC 2440 is considered broken.

Please use something more recent like pool.sks-keyservers.net.

++++++++++++++
In response to the other message you sent, please do not send encrypted
messages to the list -- it makes the nuns at the Scary Devil
Monastery[1] attach lead pipe to their rulers.


[1] http://catb.org/~esr/jargon/html/S/scary-devil-monastery.html

-- 
John P. Clizbe                      Inet:John (a) Mozilla-Enigmail.org
You can't spell fiasco without SCO. hkp://keyserver.gingerbear.net  or
     mailto:pgp-public-keys at gingerbear.net?subject=HELP

Q:"Just how do the residents of Haiku, Hawai'i hold conversations?"
A:"An odd melody / island voices on the winds / surplus of vowels"

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From david.owens at Safe-mail.net  Mon May 25 10:18:59 2009
From: david.owens at Safe-mail.net (david.owens at Safe-mail.net)
Date: Mon, 25 May 2009 13:18:59 -0400
Subject: [Enigmail] test
Message-ID: <N1N-3IVJV_1vvY@Safe-mail.net>

test

From John at Mozilla-Enigmail.org  Mon May 25 10:26:49 2009
From: John at Mozilla-Enigmail.org (John Clizbe)
Date: Mon, 25 May 2009 12:26:49 -0500
Subject: [Enigmail] test
In-Reply-To: <N1N-3IVJV_1vvY@Safe-mail.net>
References: <N1N-3IVJV_1vvY@Safe-mail.net>
Message-ID: <4A1AD4D9.1030900@Mozilla-Enigmail.org>

david.owens at Safe-mail.net wrote:
> test

What were you testing?

-- 
John P. Clizbe                      Inet:John (a) Mozilla-Enigmail.org
You can't spell fiasco without SCO. hkp://keyserver.gingerbear.net  or
     mailto:pgp-public-keys at gingerbear.net?subject=HELP

Q:"Just how do the residents of Haiku, Hawai'i hold conversations?"
A:"An odd melody / island voices on the winds / surplus of vowels"

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From hrickards at l33tmyst.com  Mon May 25 10:29:23 2009
From: hrickards at l33tmyst.com (Harry Rickards)
Date: Mon, 25 May 2009 18:29:23 +0100
Subject: [Enigmail] Test encrypted email
In-Reply-To: <4A1AD250.9090100@Mozilla-Enigmail.org>
References: <4A1ACAE7.7060306@l33tmyst.com>
	<4A1AD250.9090100@Mozilla-Enigmail.org>
Message-ID: <4A1AD573.6000006@l33tmyst.com>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

On 05/25/09 18:16, John Clizbe wrote:
> Harry Rickards wrote:
>> Please could someone send me a test encrypted email encrypted to GPG Key
>> ID 646ED06A, so I can test whether I've got everything setup correctly.
> 
> Believe it or not, the simplest test is to send yourself encrypted
> email. I've use that technique many times when testing things.
> 
>> If needed, my public key's at
>> http://pgp.mit.edu:11371/pks/lookup?op=get&search=0x646ED06A.
> 
> Please Please Please Do NOT use that server. The code is unmaintained
> and for many new features of RFC 2440 is considered broken.
> 
> Please use something more recent like pool.sks-keyservers.net.
> 
> ++++++++++++++
> In response to the other message you sent, please do not send encrypted
> messages to the list -- it makes the nuns at the Scary Devil
> Monastery[1] attach lead pipe to their rulers.
> 
> 
> [1] http://catb.org/~esr/jargon/html/S/scary-devil-monastery.html
> 
> 
> 
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Enigmail mailing list
> Enigmail at mozdev.org
> https://www.mozdev.org/mailman/listinfo/enigmail

Okay, thanks for the advice. My public key is on pool.sks-keyservers.net
as well, I just used pgp.mit.edu off of the top of my head. Is sending
signed mail to the list okay?

- -- 
Many thanks
Harry Rickards (GPG Key ID:646ED06A)

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- ------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------
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Version: GnuPG v1.4.9 (GNU/Linux)
Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/

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From darylstyrk at gmail.com  Mon May 25 10:48:45 2009
From: darylstyrk at gmail.com (Daryl Styrk)
Date: Mon, 25 May 2009 13:48:45 -0400
Subject: [Enigmail] Test encrypted email
In-Reply-To: <4A1AD573.6000006@l33tmyst.com>
References: <4A1ACAE7.7060306@l33tmyst.com>
	<4A1AD250.9090100@Mozilla-Enigmail.org>
	<4A1AD573.6000006@l33tmyst.com>
Message-ID: <20090525174845.GA6436@t61.daryl.homelinux.net>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

On Mon, May 25, 2009 at 06:29:23PM +0100, Harry Rickards wrote:
> 
> Okay, thanks for the advice. My public key is on pool.sks-keyservers.net
> as well, I just used pgp.mit.edu off of the top of my head. Is sending
> signed mail to the list okay?

Yes

- --
Daryl Styrk
Naples, FL USA


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From John at Mozilla-Enigmail.org  Mon May 25 11:00:04 2009
From: John at Mozilla-Enigmail.org (John Clizbe)
Date: Mon, 25 May 2009 13:00:04 -0500
Subject: [Enigmail] Test encrypted email
In-Reply-To: <4A1AD573.6000006@l33tmyst.com>
References: <4A1ACAE7.7060306@l33tmyst.com>	<4A1AD250.9090100@Mozilla-Enigmail.org>
	<4A1AD573.6000006@l33tmyst.com>
Message-ID: <4A1ADCA4.3040600@Mozilla-Enigmail.org>

Harry Rickards wrote:
> On 05/25/09 18:16, John Clizbe wrote:
>> Harry Rickards wrote:

<entire quoted email snipped>
> 
> Okay, thanks for the advice. My public key is on pool.sks-keyservers.net
> as well, I just used pgp.mit.edu off of the top of my head. Is sending
> signed mail to the list okay?

Signed mail is encouraged. Either inline or PGP/MIME.

It is nicer if you trim down the quoted part of replies.

Re the pgp.mit.edu thingy: pool.sks-keyservers.net remains the more
robust solution. That said, if _you_ want to point at a single server,
you may, I just ask you think at "single point of failure" beforehand.

You may find status on all the presently known SKS keyservers at
http://sks-keyservers.net/status/  or
http://www.pramberger.at/peter/services/keyserver/network/ .

(Don't attach too much emphasis to the number of keys. Keyservers are
located around the globe and only run statistics once per day. Having
the greatest number keys only means that that given server had its stats
run closest to the polling script for the status page running.)

-- 
John P. Clizbe                      Inet:John (a) Mozilla-Enigmail.org
You can't spell fiasco without SCO. hkp://keyserver.gingerbear.net  or
     mailto:pgp-public-keys at gingerbear.net?subject=HELP

Q:"Just how do the residents of Haiku, Hawai'i hold conversations?"
A:"An odd melody / island voices on the winds / surplus of vowels"

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From hrickards at l33tmyst.com  Mon May 25 11:04:36 2009
From: hrickards at l33tmyst.com (Harry Rickards)
Date: Mon, 25 May 2009 19:04:36 +0100
Subject: [Enigmail] Test encrypted email
In-Reply-To: <4A1ADCA4.3040600@Mozilla-Enigmail.org>
References: <4A1ACAE7.7060306@l33tmyst.com>	<4A1AD250.9090100@Mozilla-Enigmail.org>	<4A1AD573.6000006@l33tmyst.com>
	<4A1ADCA4.3040600@Mozilla-Enigmail.org>
Message-ID: <4A1ADDB4.1090900@l33tmyst.com>

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Hash: SHA1

On 05/25/09 19:00, John Clizbe wrote:
> Harry Rickards wrote:
>> On 05/25/09 18:16, John Clizbe wrote:
>>> Harry Rickards wrote:
> 
> <entire quoted email snipped>
>> Okay, thanks for the advice. My public key is on pool.sks-keyservers.net
>> as well, I just used pgp.mit.edu off of the top of my head. Is sending
>> signed mail to the list okay?
...
> Re the pgp.mit.edu thingy: pool.sks-keyservers.net remains the more
> robust solution. That said, if _you_ want to point at a single server,
> you may, I just ask you think at "single point of failure" beforehand.
> 
> You may find status on all the presently known SKS keyservers at
> http://sks-keyservers.net/status/  or
> http://www.pramberger.at/peter/services/keyserver/network/ .
> 
> (Don't attach too much emphasis to the number of keys. Keyservers are
> located around the globe and only run statistics once per day. Having
> the greatest number keys only means that that given server had its stats
> run closest to the polling script for the status page running.)
> 

Thanks for the links. I don't actually rely on one single keyserver, but
I generally just use either pgp.mit.edu (no more) or
pool.sks-keyservers.net when I'm linking to my key.

Again, thanks for the tips everyone.

- -- 
Many thanks
Harry Rickards (GPG Key ID:646ED06A)

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From matt.hickford at gmail.com  Mon May 25 12:10:08 2009
From: matt.hickford at gmail.com (Matthew Hickford)
Date: Mon, 25 May 2009 20:10:08 +0100
Subject: [Enigmail] Enigmail for Thunderbird 3 on 64 bit Linux
In-Reply-To: <4A1AD21E.5060104@FamilleCollet.com>
References: <4A15751B.7090407@gmail.com> <4A1AD21E.5060104@FamilleCollet.com>
Message-ID: <4A1AED10.5000303@gmail.com>

Thanks Remi

I read your message the day after, I also built enigmail for Fedora 11,
I sent a copy of the build to Olav (enigmail dev)

Matt


From patrick at mozilla-enigmail.org  Mon May 25 23:34:56 2009
From: patrick at mozilla-enigmail.org (Patrick Brunschwig)
Date: Tue, 26 May 2009 08:34:56 +0200
Subject: [Enigmail] Enigmail 'latched' onto invalide gpg key
In-Reply-To: <4A1AC48D.9030307@gmail.com>
References: <4A1AC48D.9030307@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4A1B8D90.80207@mozilla-enigmail.org>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
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Brendan Sullivan wrote:
> Hello all, I've recently tried to register a gpg key (first one ever)
> and at the same time installed enigmail for Thunderbird. I didn't
> realize enigmail would handle that for me, so at the cmd line I ran:
> 
> gpg --gen-key
> 
> and ran through the options and set it up and then :
> 
> gpg --server keyserver.ubuntu.com --send-keys
> 
> waited for my confirmation email, and in the mean time, setup enigmail
> (via the initial wizard) with my new gpg key and associated it with my
> primary email account.
> 
> When the confirmation email came I got a surprise. I must have mistyped
> my ~25 character passphrase twice as I could not unlock the encrypted
> confirmation email from the keyserver. At this point I didn't know about
> revocation certificates so I just deleted the key and started over.
> Registered the new key, updated my new key in enigmail and it
> /decrypted/ my confirmation email just fine. However when i went to
> compose an email and send it, I got the following error :
> 
> gpg command line and output:
> /usr/bin/gpg --charset utf8 --batch --no-tty --status-fd 2 -t
> --clearsign -u 0xD9084941 --use-agent
> gpg: skipped "0xD9084941":secret key not available
> gpg: [stdin]: clearsign failed: secret key not available
> 
> Now, the problem is that D9084941 is that 'first key' that I do not have
> the secret (or public) files for anymore....and no matter what I do I
> can't get enigmail to use my new current key FOR SENDING email that is
> setup and registered and works for decrypting mail in Thunderbird.
> 
> Does anyone have any ideas? Sorry for being so wordy, I'm really
> confused as to what is not getting configured correctly. If you need any
> more info please let me know.

You should modify your account settings and set your new key explicitly.
Menu Edit > Account Settings > OpenPGP Security: activate "Use specific
OpenPGP key ID"; then click on the "Select Key button".

- -Patrick
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From b.sullivan83 at gmail.com  Tue May 26 04:21:27 2009
From: b.sullivan83 at gmail.com (Brendan Sullivan)
Date: Tue, 26 May 2009 07:21:27 -0400
Subject: [Enigmail] Enigmail 'latched' onto invalide gpg key
In-Reply-To: <4A1B8D90.80207@mozilla-enigmail.org>
References: <4A1AC48D.9030307@gmail.com> <4A1B8D90.80207@mozilla-enigmail.org>
Message-ID: <4A1BD0B7.4070103@gmail.com>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1


Patrick,

That worked perfectly! Thank you for your help. I did not think to check
in account settings as Enigmail added it's own menu to Thunderbird.
Didn't realize it changed other menus as well.

Thanks again,
- -Brendan

Patrick Brunschwig wrote:
> 
> You should modify your account settings and set your new key explicitly.
> Menu Edit > Account Settings > OpenPGP Security: activate "Use specific
> OpenPGP key ID"; then click on the "Select Key button".
> 
> -Patrick
_______________________________________________
Enigmail mailing list
Enigmail at mozdev.org
https://www.mozdev.org/mailman/listinfo/enigmail
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From elwoodzulu at gmail.com  Wed May 27 13:35:37 2009
From: elwoodzulu at gmail.com (mr mark)
Date: Wed, 27 May 2009 16:35:37 -0400
Subject: [Enigmail] please remove me
Message-ID: <4A1DA419.7010705@gmail.com>

thank you

From oberon at q.com  Wed May 27 13:37:18 2009
From: oberon at q.com (Oberon)
Date: Wed, 27 May 2009 15:37:18 -0500
Subject: [Enigmail] please remove me
In-Reply-To: <4A1DA419.7010705@gmail.com>
References: <4A1DA419.7010705@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <BLU0-SMTP4784A87FC38773F9CBEE17DF530@phx.gbl>

On 5/27/2009 3:35 PM, mr mark wrote:

> thank you
> __________

Or, you might choose to just do it yourself.  Click on the link below
for a simple guide even you can follow.


-- 
No magic is ever truly destructive. For what is destruction,
except creation with an agenda?
-----------------------------------------------------------
This mail is from The Old Sinner, a.k.a The Beast 333. (Not
evil,  just a little bit naughty.)   This mail is a natural
product.  Slight variations in grammar and spelling can  be
expected and in no way diminish  the intent of the message.
-----------------------------------------------------------

From jmoore3rd at bellsouth.net  Wed May 27 14:07:41 2009
From: jmoore3rd at bellsouth.net (John W. Moore III)
Date: Wed, 27 May 2009 17:07:41 -0400
Subject: [Enigmail] please remove me
In-Reply-To: <4A1DA419.7010705@gmail.com>
References: <4A1DA419.7010705@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4A1DAB9D.2010505@bellsouth.net>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA512

mr mark wrote:

> https://www.mozdev.org/mailman/listinfo/enigmail


Please Note this Link which appears at the bottom of _every_ Post on
this List.  All that is required is for You to 'REmove' Yourself the
same way that You signed up for this bulletin/List/forum.

No one twisted Your arm to make You subscribe and no one will twist it
to force You to stay.  :-D

JOHN ;)
Timestamp: Wednesday 27 May 2009, 17:06  --400 (Eastern Daylight Time)


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Comment: Gossamer Spider Web of Trust: https://www.gswot.org
Comment: Homepage:  http://tinyurl.com/yzhbhx

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